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Ranger Analysis: Where is the Youth? (Update)

Give the kids a shot! That phrase has been uttered, written, screamed, yelled and talked about ever since the lockout. This off-season has been no exception. Many of you at one point or another have discussed the lack of kids—or home grown talent—on the Rangers. And for good reason, Sather hasn’t exactly agreed with that philosophy of thinking.  But as of this off-season I think Sather has gotten the memo—finally!

Many of you have been complaining that there aren’t enough kids on the roster and that some of the signings shouldn’t have been made because they take spots away from kids. Well let’s take a more in depth look at that statement. Here is what the roster looks like now (with what I think the lines will turn out to be).

Higgins-Dubinsky-Gaborik
Callahan-Drury-Kotalik
Avery-Anisimov-Zherdev?
Brashear-Boyle-Byers?

Extra possibilities: Parenteau

Redden-Rozsival
Staal-Girardi
Gilroy-?

Extra possabilities: Sanguinetti, Heikkinen, Del Zotto, Potter, Sauer

 

Lundqvist
Valiquette

 

With the forwards I am assuming that Anisimov and Byers make the team, it works out for this because if only one makes the team—I have to think at least one makes the team out of camp—we can assume Parenteau will take one of their slots. For defenseman everything works out—can’t imagine the Rangers are giving Gilroy 1.75 a year on a one way contract to play in the AHL and the other slot will be given to a kid. So let’s do a little math now:

Of the forwards 4 of the 12 are home grown, that’s 33%; that’s also assuming that Zherdev is signed if he isn’t then a prospect will likely take his place making it 5 of 12 players. Of the 6 defenseman 4 of them are home grown, that’s 66%; also assuming neither is moved and the spot is given to a kid. And of the goalies 1 of the two is home grown, that’s 50%; this shouldn’t change. If you look at the entire 20 man roster 45% of the players are home grown talents, with all of the factors I wrote above in place.  Now for those of you that think that that still isn’t enough to give Sather a pat on the back for his youth movement let’s look at each player that isn’t home grown and see if a prospect could take their place.  

Marian Gaborik: No prospect can do what he will do day in and day out.  
Chris Higgins: I don’t think any prospect—aside from maybe Anisimov—is going to put up 20+ goals a year.
Chris Drury: Again I don’t think any prospect—aside from maybe Anisimov—might put up 20+ goals a year.
Ales Kotalik: I feel like a broken record. Again no prospect except for maybe Anisimov is going to put up the numbers he will.
Sean Avery: NO prospect can do what Avery does, enough said.
NiK Zherdev: If he is resigned no prospect can do what he does with the puck.  
Donald Brashear:Not even debatable, Brashear is the best fighter in the league, no AHL prospect is even near that status.
Brian Boyle:I suppose you can argue that a prospect can take his place, but he is very skilled and will probably do better than 90% of the prospects in the AHL.
Wade Redden: There might be a slim argument here.
Michael Rozsival:No defenseman in the AHL can do what Rozsival does, sorry but it’s true.
Stephan Valiquette: Best backup in the league, no goalie can do what he does.

So there you have it, I would say maybe two players are replaceable—Boyle and Redden. I would say that Sather has done a great job with the kids, do you agree? Have at it in the comments.

Update: Woah! I can see from the comments that there may be a slight misunderstanding here. I am not trying to say that in Sathers entire tenure he has done well with this particular youth campaign, he really has done well in any campaign but alas. What I am arguing is that in the past two or three years (when I feel he really took giving the kids a shot seriously) he has done a good job. To go from basically 10% home grown talent to 45% in two years is pretty good to me. Yes he is making up for previous mistakes but it had to be done sometime and I think he is doing a pretty good job.

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Looking at only numbers is wrong

You look only at how much offense these players can put up. Hockey players are suppose do also play defense too

What about work ethic, willingness to play a physical game, willingness to kill penalties, heck that willingness to play defense?

You keep using “No prospect can do what he does” but you can not say that because you do not know what any of the prospect can do until they are given a chance.

You also have not seen most of the Ranger prospects in action so you do not know what they have the potential to do.

You want some numbers to chew on then chew on this one 7.7%

That is the number of drafted players from 2000-2004 still with the Rangers. Out of 52 draft picks in 5 different drafts only Dubinsky, Callahan, Henrik and IF Byers makes the roster are Rangers.

3 from the 2004 draft and 1 from the 2000 draft but no other draft.

Please do not give Sather any pat on the back for developing homegrown talent if he had then the Rangers would not have had to bring 55% of that roster of your from outside.

A winning draft is when you get 2 productive players from each draft and for 2009-10 then the Rangers should have players from at least the 2006 draft or a total of 14 players on the roster.

When the Rangers stop having to use free agency and trades to fill the core roles then pat Sather on the back until then please realize that this is year 10 of the Sather era and the Rangers are no closer to being a serious contender than in 1999

by theprospectpark on Jul 14, 2009 5:37 AM EDT reply actions  

But you can only do that by drafting that high level talent, which Sather has struck out on. Until he drafts that talent, he needs to fill those holes with FAs.

by Dave Shapiro on Jul 14, 2009 9:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

he's done OK recently tho

I mean, its not like the goalie position is a need right? That was Sather? I don’t know how Prospectpark can call this team NOT a contender with the King on the team. When he gets hot a 1-0 lead can be all that’s needed. He’s young too and may in fact be getting better I don’t know…..

Girardi and Staal are NHL caliber D-Men, with what seems like a ton still to come up.

Animisov seems like a nice talent, Calllahan and Duber are pretty nice parts.

On Top 10 picks, kinda similar to that other team in the Garden, they’ve struck out horribly tho

Sather’s done OK. As NY fans we tend to not be patient and only remember the bad things when the teams don’t win championships. Unfortunately most only know the worst lately.

But the Rangers seem to be going in the right direction. The only thing they were missing this past season was ONE PLAYER who can score consistently. I do believe Gaborik fits that bill.

by FreeBradshaw on Jul 14, 2009 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Hank was a 7th round pick and it was complete luck that he turned out the way he did. That was a complete crapshoot, and the strike is the only reason why Hank ever got noticed, as he played against top NHL talent during the strike.

Girardi was another crapshoot, an undrafted FA. Staal was can’t miss, and the ONLY first round pick to ever make an impact in the Sather era.

With the 2005-2009 draft picks, it’s too soon to tell.

The consistent whiffing on first round talent is alarming, specifically 2003 and 2004.

by Dave Shapiro on Jul 14, 2009 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

Much like Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Luc Robitaille, Franzen, etc.

who were all late picks in the draft. You never know what a young player can mature into.

Lopez wants it away, and it's hit deep to left center, Andruw Jones on the run, this one has a chance... home run!!, Mike Piazza!, and the Mets lead 3 to 2!!
-Howie Rose
Gary Thorne=Simply the Best!

by The American Mr.Hockey on Jul 14, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

That doesn’t make you a good drafter, that makes you lucky.

by Dave Shapiro on Jul 14, 2009 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

The point is that the draft is a crapshoot

1st round busts
6th round gems.

Lopez wants it away, and it's hit deep to left center, Andruw Jones on the run, this one has a chance... home run!!, Mike Piazza!, and the Mets lead 3 to 2!!
-Howie Rose
Gary Thorne=Simply the Best!

by The American Mr.Hockey on Jul 14, 2009 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sorry for the double reply, but the front office needs an overhaul, specifically splitting the President/GM roles, and the scouting department needs to be overhauled (pending the results of the 2005-2009 drafts)

by Dave Shapiro on Jul 14, 2009 9:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

I would say that drafting is a little harder

when you make the playoffs and get knocked out in the first or second round. Although when Sather did have top 10 picks in the Sather era he failed miserably.

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by Joe Fortunato on Jul 14, 2009 9:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

Who drafted Cherepanov? I’m not sure I would call that one a failure, he appeared to be a blue-chip prospect.

by NYdemo on Jul 14, 2009 9:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

It’s an omission from judgment on Sather, and a pure tragedy.

by Dave Shapiro on Jul 14, 2009 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

Cherepanov was an easy pick for Glen

The only question was if he would transfer over from Russia.

Lopez wants it away, and it's hit deep to left center, Andruw Jones on the run, this one has a chance... home run!!, Mike Piazza!, and the Mets lead 3 to 2!!
-Howie Rose
Gary Thorne=Simply the Best!

by The American Mr.Hockey on Jul 14, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Not sure I agree

I’m not sure I agree that Sather has only now gotten the message. I would say last season and even the prior had a fair number of youngsters. In the past 2 seasons we’ve seen significant playing time for Dubinsky, Callahan, Korpikoski, Dawes, Orr, Staal, Girardi and of course Lundquist. I realize Orr was not a Rangers draft pick, but he only played 20+/- games for the Bruins so his professional career really took of here in NY.

By my count we will have roughly the same number of young home grown players this year as last.

by NYdemo on Jul 14, 2009 8:38 AM EDT reply actions  

Idealist

Im an idealist, and usually your farm system should yield some good players. In the Rangers case, they draft like crap so they bring up at best Above avg guys, but none you can bet the franchise on.

its true.

lundqvist is a 7th rounder? or something like that. Staal they got in the first round, a rarity. every other first rounder pretty much blows… Hugh Jessimen, Pavel Brendl, Jamie Lundmark, and we can all list more. its just the rangers arent good at drafting… its gotten better in the recent years, but its still yet to be seen 100%. Chereponov is dead. that wouldve been one of the best picks.

by ImaMoose on Jul 14, 2009 9:23 AM EDT reply actions  

I agree but Chereponov fell to us

Meaning that in the first round when Sather actually has to sift through whats left he usually does pretty horrible.

But to me in rounds 2-7 Sather has done—within recent memory—a really good job.

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by Joe Fortunato on Jul 14, 2009 9:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

Rounds 2-7 are where championships are made. Arguement ended lol?

"Jaromir Jagr.... it's a POWERPLAY GOAL!"

by rmc235 on Jul 14, 2009 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not for the Penguins. =P

"Malik now." "6 foot 6, 238, not a noted goal scorer but he's gonna give it a shot here." "Malik has not scored this year. In on Kolzig, faked it....SCORES"

by Calm Down on Jul 14, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Manny Malhotra

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by Jim Schmiedeberg on Jul 14, 2009 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yes Jim

Sather sucks in the first round, we know … Al Montoya

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by Joe Fortunato on Jul 14, 2009 9:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think Montoya cleaned my windshield at an intersection yesterday

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by Jim Schmiedeberg on Jul 14, 2009 10:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

Blackhawks just fired GM Dale Tallon

Think we can get him? He did a nice job with Chicago before he forgot to resign all their RFAs

by AllHailTheKing30 on Jul 14, 2009 10:35 AM EDT reply actions  

Isn't ..

Messier looking for a Job? I think he would do a great job.

by Poe678 on Jul 14, 2009 11:10 AM EDT reply actions  

I think Messier would make for a better coach than General Manager

His leadership skills would really help out a locker room.

Lopez wants it away, and it's hit deep to left center, Andruw Jones on the run, this one has a chance... home run!!, Mike Piazza!, and the Mets lead 3 to 2!!
-Howie Rose
Gary Thorne=Simply the Best!

by The American Mr.Hockey on Jul 14, 2009 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

I agree with you, but I honestly think he would have a better eye for talent.

by Poe678 on Jul 14, 2009 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think Messier would be a better GM, players like him often have a hard time behind the bench because they just can’t get past the fact that not every player can do the things they could.

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by Jim Schmiedeberg on Jul 14, 2009 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Look at

Wayne Gretzky for a prime example.

by Poe678 on Jul 14, 2009 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

well, Wayne is an easy target, but that team is doomed, and has been for years. No money, no big talent, and no fans in the seats.

That being said, no I don’t think Wayne is any great shakes as a coach, he is there as a figurehead

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by Jim Schmiedeberg on Jul 14, 2009 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

I am currently writing for the sporting news, and I get to read about all the GM’s and being an avid rangers fan, I attempt to keep my biased opinions out of the Magazine. However, Sather needs to go. Messier or Leetch would be the perfect fit for new york and honestly was new york hockey fan wouldnt want Leetch or Messier to be our GM.

let me know what you think.

by Sportingnewskid on Jul 14, 2009 3:31 PM EDT reply actions  

Also man I forgot to mention that I agree with every discription of every player….however Redden is getting paid to much to stay in new york….we should have gone out after Ohlund or a veteran to work with our super tandem of Staal and Girardi…you agree?

by Sportingnewskid on Jul 14, 2009 3:36 PM EDT reply actions  

Two things

First- Zherdev is probably gone. Lisin most likely takes his place.
Second – Is this team any better that the team they had last year? I don’t think so. I’ll grant you that a full season of Gaborik is better than whatever Gomez could give you. Kotalik and Naslund are probably a wash. Higgins at his best (a big if) isn’t as good as Antropov. Just on those moves alone the team is in the same spot it was last year. No add to that the loss of Zherdev, (To be replaced by big questions marks) and the useless fourth line which is a major downgrade from Betts and Sjostrom.

The bottom line is this team is at best a borderline playoff team. That being said, I’m fine with that if they let young guys play and get rid of bad contracts. But even though they have some more young guys in, they still have a slew of bad contract that will handicap the team in the future.

by Reg Dunlop on Jul 14, 2009 10:45 PM EDT reply actions  

A healthy Gaborik is waaaaaaaaaaaaay more impactful than you think. he has been terrorizing the oilers for some time now. Glad he is gone

Grachev can put up 20 goals too every season.

by SumOil on Jul 15, 2009 6:08 AM EDT reply actions  

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GP W L OTL PT
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(updated 2.15.2012 at 8:59 AM EST)

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