The Cost Of Buying Out Drury
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 10:00 AM EST
in New York Rangers Analysis
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Rangers captain Chris Drury has not produced enough to be deemed worthy of his $7.05 million cap hit the past two seasons. Signed by the Rangers in 2007, Drury put up numbers consistent with his career average in his first two years with the Rangers, with 58 points and 56 points. He played significant minutes at all points during the game, and couldn’t really be called a "bust" those two seasons*. It wasn’t until last season when the Rangers high priced center started to see his game disappear. His production was nearly cut in half, and his role diminished to that of a fourth line player. That same trend has continued this year, as Drury has no goals and just four points in 16 games this season.
*-Note that his numbers were consistent with what he had produced in his previous eight seasons. He’s not a "bust" if he produces at that clip.
Despite his lack of production, Drury still serves a purpose. He is a great captain, he kills penalties, he wins face-offs, and he blocks a ton of shots. That said, $7.05 million is a lot to pay for a player who plays ten minutes per game. Drury can’t be demoted due to his no-movement clause, but that doesn’t seem to be an issue. It would be a public relations nightmare to demote the captain of an NHL club. Trade is also impossible with that cap hit, even if his actual salary does drop to $5 million next season.
The only way the Rangers would be able to rid themselves of Drury is by buying him out. Buying out Drury during the summer of 2011 would result in a $3.7 million cap hit for the 2011-2012 season (saving the Rangers $3.35 million in cap space), and a $1.67 million cap hit for the 2012-2013 season, a season where Drury’s initial contract would have expired. The $3.35 million in cap space saved goes a long way, especially considering Wade Redden and his $6.5 million cap hit will be on the summer cap. During a summer when the Rangers will look to sign Brad Richards, every dollar in cap space is important.
Numbers aside, buying out Drury will cost the Rangers their best face-off guy, one of their best penalty killers, and their captain. It’s tough to replace that kind of role on the ice and in the locker room, and there is no guarantee that the Rangers will be successful in luring a top center to MSG next season. In the end, it’s a question about whether having Drury for one year at $7 million is better than having him for two years at $3.7 million and $1.67 million. It’s a tough call, and it’s hard to say if there’s a right answer.
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he sucks
when is the last time he even scored a goal? assist?
god what a waste
should of kept Gomez, at least Gomez can be a first line center
and right now with injuries to everyone, he needs to show up, and he hasnt
idk with a 4th line of all Whale’s and Drury that high up I am concerned
when I have EC Cally Dubi Fed all back I will be fine
because with all of those guys and Stepan Wolski Gaborik MZA Boyle Prust AA we are good enough to win games, quite a bit of games
but spread out over injuries like this is really putting holes in our lineup
by Archie Barberio on Jan 21, 2011 10:13 AM EST reply actions
Gomez? Yeah, he’s better than Drury is right now, but that isn’t saying a whole lot. Gomez deserved to be traded, he had a contract that was just as bad if not worse than Drury’s, and he too was an uninspiring player for the Rangers in his two seasons.
McDonagh looks good in his short stint with the big club so far; toss in Valentenko and the Rangers still win by getting rid of Gomez despite Higgins’ awful half-season with NYR…..after all that they got Prust for Higgins and Kotalik, and right now I wouldn’t trade Prust straight-up for Scott Gomez. Prust is a heart and soul player, whereas Gomer is just another guy cashing big checks and laughing off tough losses….
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jan 21, 2011 10:29 AM EST up reply actions
Well the full NMC vs Gomez’s partial NTC I think was a big deciding factor in who got moved. I actually thought Gomez would be a decent fit on the Habs because of their fast skating style of game but from what I’ve seen and read, he’s been every bit the disappointment up there as he was on Broadway.
But getting McD I think will prove to be jewel of that trade.
by MyFavBaseballSquadron on Jan 21, 2011 10:55 AM EST up reply actions
Gomez wasn't THAT bad here
I feel like a broken record saying this, but imagine if he had a WING to play with? He was still always near the top in scoring for us and while he numbers weren’t off the charts, they were pretty good for playing in Renney’s “D 1st… and 2nd … and 3rd” system. He’d play his game, carry the puck in, and have NO OPTIONS to pass it to. 7 mil per is ALOT for anybody, but I would say of all Slats mistakes, Gomez was closest to being a sane signing. There wasn’t alot of other options on the market that summer, but I would say if Slats had made an offer for Ryan Smyth he could have gotten a scorer for Gomez and a better leader then Dru for less money.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
He had Jagr for a year.
But more to the point, Gomez produced towards his career averages, which means he wasn’t really a bust. Drury did so the first two years too, it’s just the past two years have been abysmal.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 11:13 AM EST up reply actions
Jagr was a wierdo at that point
By the end of the 1st season he Dubi was up to play with Jagr. Jagr was into that half-court, “keep away” game he played when he lost a step. I’m not knocking Jagr, but he was just doing his own thing.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
and Gomez was and still is a smirking twerp
As long as we’re making judgmental statements on people who we don’t know….
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jan 21, 2011 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
Well I was typing something similar to this, but you beat me to it.
My only argument is when you say it would be a public relations nightmare. Seeing as how based on what we see at least 75% of the Ranger fan populous wants him gone, I would disagree. If by public relations you mean the media, I’ll give you that.
He’s not that great on face-offs anymore (54% when I last looked), and I would again make the argument that he has become an afterthought on this team. You don’t find places to “plug in” your Captain and one of your highest paid players, and Tortorella telling him last week that he is a “utility forward” to me speaks volumes.
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by Jim Schmiedeberg on Jan 21, 2011 11:20 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
54% has him among the league leaders (you have to filter out all those who are at 100% for winning 1 face off)
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
Drury
Concussion last year. Enough said. He may never be the same.
by Leetch4prezofNYR on Jan 21, 2011 4:11 PM EST up reply actions
He had Jagr and Shanny his first year here. They might have been at the end of their ropes, but not developing chemistry with a couple of guys that scored about 1300 goals is a pretty damning indictment.
by MyFavBaseballSquadron on Jan 21, 2011 11:14 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
No, no—it wasn’t Gomez’ fault….those guys just weren’t as good as him! :)
Joke, of course.
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jan 21, 2011 11:16 AM EST up reply actions
Well, you've gotta have the right pieces to make things work
Part of Slats problem is just expects to bring guys in and have them all work out together. We need to start thinking about WHERE the guys we’re bringing in fit into what we’re doing.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
Hit on this above, but quickly
Jagr was playing his half court game back then, and Shanny was too old to play with the Red Wings anymore, The team that can squeeze the last few good years out of any player.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 11:25 AM EST up reply actions
Gomez is a skater, he brings the puck in and looks to set people up off the rush. Neither Jagr or Shanny had nearly the speed that Gomez had when he was here. That being said, Gomez now plays with a lot of quick guys and still hasn’t produced much this year.
Gomez and Plekanec are two guys Martin throws out against other top lines.
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by red army line on Jan 21, 2011 12:35 PM EST up reply actions
It was bad all around on Sather's part
..the contracts. Neither one was worth the dough from the start. Both guys were barely 20 goal 60 point a year players throughout their careers-and on better teams to boot. Why would anyone in his right mind offer them $7M a year? Did Sather really think they were on the upside of their careers, and would start producing superstar stats to go with the superstar contracts?
Drury is a 4th line player and penalty killer at best now. Gomez is smirking in Montreal, on pace for a big 45 points. Redden is in the minors. The three worst contracts in Rangers history, all at once. The agents involved must have laughed all the way to the bank.
by The Man Comin' Down Your Block on Jan 22, 2011 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
You’re gonna toss Holik out of the mix for 3 worst?
by BuckarooClub on Jan 22, 2011 1:35 PM EST up reply actions
Montreal wouldn’t want Drury, so it never could have happened. They WANTED Gomez for a long time. It’s not like the Rangers had a choice of which one to move out. There was only demand for one.
Pierre McGuire needs to go away.
by MartyEqualsPansy on Jan 21, 2011 4:59 PM EST up reply actions
It would be a public relations nightmare to demote the captain of an NHL club.
That’s because any other club would have taken the “C” away. Marleau and Thornton both lost their letters. Kaberle didn’t get the “A” back this season in Toronto. Are the Sharks flameouts really any worse then what we’ve seen under Drury. If we could play inspired hockey long enough under Drury’s reign to GET a #1 seed, that would be a major victory.
This team has looked FLAT the whole time Dru has worn the letter. The front office seems to love him, so it seems like the best answer for EVERYONE is Dru took the Luongo route and “gave up” the captaincy. Let’s face it, he doesn’t want to be captain, or win hockey games. Just before his “comeback” this winter, the" thing he craved the most" was “hot oil pizza”, he wanted to win a medal for “best pizza in the state of Connecticut” and “become a better fisherman” is on the top of his to do list. If you haven’t seen the video of this gem from “The Feast” then by all means check it out here, and ask yourself WHY Dru is still our captain.
So your argument is that he has a life outside of hockey and that means he’s not fit for being a hockey captain?
by dar9898 on Jan 21, 2011 11:10 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
No, he can have a life outside of hockey
As long as he remembers that hockey is what pays the bills so he can have that life. She lobbed him plenty of chances to make ONE reference to wanting to win with the rangers, and all he talked about was Pizza and Fishing. That’s messed up.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
Considering his team, maybe thinking about hockey was too painful for him.
[ducks head]
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by red army line on Jan 21, 2011 12:32 PM EST up reply actions
Uh dude she's a food blogger
Why would he talk to her about hockey?
by dar9898 on Jan 21, 2011 12:40 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
So True.
I’m not sure why but that video pisses me off. He is not passionate enough to be the captain of this team. The guy doesn’t even mention hockey. Its time for him to retire and go manage that restaurant and take care of his boat on the Long Island Sound. When have you seen him step up for an interview? When have you seen him lead any kind of charge?
I used to call him a two-way player but not anymore. I’ve always come to his defense. But really, what’s gotten into this guy? Why can’t we strip him of the C and get it over with?
d
Maybe the team looks flat because other teams are faster and more skilled? Notice that hasn’t been the case this year, when the Rangers got younger and faster.
The front office and the coaching staff knows more about the team than we do.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 11:11 AM EST up reply actions
not only does the front office like him but more importantly
The players,like, and respect him as their captain and I think that with team built as it is now it would destroy their morality and confidence if the team just takes C away from drury in mid season and even though he can’t play meaningful hockey I think the guy deserves at least some shred of dignity…during the offseason I’m sure the team will have a change in its leadership
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by Kevin Power on Jan 21, 2011 11:27 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
We're younger and faster and still showing lapses in our game
How many times have we played like trash in the 1st two periods and only turned it on in the 3rd? It’s awesome that we CAN comeback it the third, but really, we shouldn’t be putting ourselves in that situation to begin with.
Summer Cap
Dave, you failed to mention that the cap has a temporary 10% increase over the summer to allow teams flexibility. With the cap at it’s current level of $59.6M the 10% increase virtually covers Redden coming back onto the cap over the summer. Redden’s monstrosity of a contract will not be an issue with trying to sign Richards, if the Rangers decide to foolishly take that path. Now if you want to try and convince Drury to do the honorable thing, pull a Naslund and retire after the season, I would be 100% behind that.
As for Drury’s contract, why bother with a buyout and adding an additional year of a cap hit? (Can you even use a buyout, does his NMC prohibit the Rangers from buying him out?) Why not stay the course with the young players on the team, let them continue to mature into the roles they are here to fill, and let Drury sulk his way through his last season as a Ranger, if he wishes to do so? Think back to this last off season when everyone was gnashing their teeth wondering where the scoring was going to come from. The big talk was that Cally and Duby are nice players but aren’t first liners. It seemed like no one even considered that at 24 years old the two of them could increase their point-per-game output and become first liners. Why not allow Stepan and Anisimov to continue developing from 35-45 point players to 55-65 point players next season? The players the Rangers will need to be a top team are here already. There is no need to bring in more top six forwards to clog up the lineup and more importantly the Salary Cap. If you want to keep our extremely young core intact over the next five years then you have to have the foresight to preserve cap space for their raises over those five years. For next season there is enough cap space to resign all of the important RFAs (Dubinsky, Callahan, Anisimov, Boyle, Sauer). You will still need to keep cap space though for Zuccarello, Stepan, Prust (UFA) and Del Zotto the following off season.
Last point, it is not unheard of to demote a captain. It happens more often than you think. It happened with Brian Leetch not too long ago. Mike Modano was stripped of his captaincy about 3 or 4 years ago and it wasn’t a PR nightmare, and Modano was still productive at the time. True, he almost jumped ship to Boston that off season which contributed to his demotion, but he stayed and continued to produce on the PP for Dallas.
The cost to re-sign their RFAs will absorb most of the cap savings they get with their expiring UFAs (Prospal, Frolov, Eminger, Fedotenko).
by MyFavBaseballSquadron on Jan 21, 2011 11:24 AM EST up reply actions
Eh
Even just quickly toying with capgeek, w/o re-signing Gilroy I come up with:
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR
FORWARDS
Marian Gaborik ($7.500m) / Derek Stepan ($0.875m) / Wojtek Wolski ($3.800m)
Sean Avery ($1.937m) / Artem Anisimov ($1.950m) / Brandon Prust ($0.800m)
Brandon Dubinsky ($4.000m) / Erik Christensen ($0.925m) / Ryan Callahan ($3.500m)
Mats Zuccarello-Aasen ($1.750m) / Brian Boyle ($1.725m) / Derek Boogaard ($1.625m)
/ Drury BUYOUT ($3.666m)
DEFENSEMEN
Marc Staal ($3.975m) / Daniel Girardi ($3.325m)
Ryan McDonagh ($1.300m) / Mike Sauer ($1.300m)
Michael Del Zotto ($1.087m)
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m) /Martin Biron ($0.875m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $59,400,000; CAP PAYROLL: $52,791,667; BONUSES: $1,487,500
CAP SPACE (20-man roster): $6,608,333
And that’s with fairly generous raises to AA, Sauer, and Boyle.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 21, 2011 11:36 AM EST up reply actions
Would a proxy for Gilroy be the 110% qualifying offer?
by MyFavBaseballSquadron on Jan 21, 2011 11:38 AM EST up reply actions
I also
Wouldn’t be the least bit surprised if Boogaard retires. I’m not saying it’s likely but this is the 2nd concussion he’s gotten and this one has seemed to end his season. A skill player could take the risk of still playing and hope not to get drilled in the head, but an enforcer who will take blows to the skull head on, I think any neurologist would recommend against that.
by MyFavBaseballSquadron on Jan 21, 2011 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I left Boog in there just because I’m not going to speculate on his health, for now he has a deal. As for Gilroy, I question whether he gets re-signed, I think they’d offer him the QO, but convince him to take less money on a 1-way deal, much like they did with EC.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 21, 2011 11:42 AM EST up reply actions
The QO will be for $1.75m, they won’t offer him that.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 11:45 AM EST up reply actions
Letting him go to UFA?
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by George E. Ays on Jan 21, 2011 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
I would assume they can get him for $1m, there’s no way he can possibly ask for more.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
I’m saying though, don’t they need to offer the QO to keep his rights?
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by George E. Ays on Jan 21, 2011 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
Yes, they need to QO him to retain his rights.
I think Dave is saying that no one else is going to offer $1.75 M to an UFA 5/6th defenseman that is 27 years old and undersized. Look at what Eminger signed for. Paul Mara was on the Rangers at about $1.25M each time they brought him back. Veteran last pair Ds are pretty inexpensive, Gilroy isn’t even expreienced, he’s just old (relative to other Ds with less than two years exp).
Right, what he said. It’s a matter of the money, not the picks.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 1:32 PM EST up reply actions
Dave,
Is the QO for Gilroy not $1.75M (his current salary) plus a standard raise? Am I mixing up MLB QOs with NHL QOs?
The standard raise doesn’t apply for those making over $1m.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 11:51 AM EST up reply actions
agreed shap
doubt they will make him a qualify offer. he’ll be a free agent but will likely be re-signed. nobody is going to pay him $1.75 million in free agency.
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by John Merrigan on Jan 21, 2011 2:44 PM EST up reply actions
To add a thought to that
If we need a little cash, buying out Wolski too could be the answer. His age makes him a cheap buyout, and while he might be playing OK, the question has to be is he playing like $3.8 million per, and do we anyone in the system who can do what he does. Considering we got him for Rosi, it’s not a tough pill to swallow for a nice chunk of cap.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 11:42 AM EST up reply actions
Doubt they buy him out, he’s been pretty decent since he came.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, the Rangers would be better served at dealing Wolski at 50 cents on the dollar versus buying him out. Based on his age and contract situation alone you could easily get a 3rd or 4th round pick for Wolski even if his production evaporates.
Good point
Guess the idea was more that I would still say Wolski is a moveable part if we want space given the players similar to him in the system.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 11:55 AM EST up reply actions
He’s movable, but I wouldn’t buy him out. He certainly has 1st line talent (and 4th line work ethic), but a full offseason + camp Torturella might kick him into high gear.
If he doesn’t take to it, then you move him during the season like other teams have.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 21, 2011 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
I agree. The guy has a ton of potential. We have seen these cases before and most of the time they have not worked out for us, but if he produces near to what he did last year, it will justify his salary/cap hit
by YouMe&Dupuis on Jan 21, 2011 12:00 PM EST up reply actions
The problem is, we’ve got a lot of “pretty decent” in the system, we need the cash for the top talent we’re dreadfully lacking. Caonenie is probably right that we could give him away though.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
Most of the talent in the system won’t be ready for next year.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
Not to drag this off topic
But if we don’t peg Wolski in our top 6, I can’t see us paying him $3.8 mil. If Cally and Dubi come back (and if we’re paying them in the 4mil ball park, they better be in the top 6), and we’re looking to add a FA like Richards, plus Gabby’s still here, that leaves one spot on wing, if you figure Step or AA are in the middle on the 2nd line (although even if we don’t bring in Richards there’s still only that one spot on the wing).
If Wolski can step up and own, that’s great. If we’re looking at him on the 3rd line, why not give some of the young guys a chance?
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 12:21 PM EST up reply actions
Nothing wrong with having a third line that can score at will. You can never have too much depth, as we learned this year.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
Ok, I get that.
My point was what can the Rangers do with that additional $3.35M in the upcoming offseason. Their roster, barring a significant trade, is set for next season. Or at least set to the point that they cannot add a UFA with a huge cap number without moving one or two young players in the offseason. So instead of opening up that small slice of cap space at a cost of losing cap space in two years, why not just bite the bullet for one more year of Drury?
Looking at George’s post below previewing a potential 11-12 roster, the Rangers don’t need the cap space. Personally, I would prefer to have the cap space and flexibility in 12-13 and feel some extra cap space for next year isn’t worth tying up cap space in two years.
Not really the point of your post, but Leetch gave the C back to Messier – he wasn’t demoted or stripped of it.
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I may have failed to mention it, but it was factored in. Trust me when I say I know the cap like the back of my hand.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 11:35 AM EST up reply actions
I know you do Dave. I saw your great post on Hockey Prospectus! Others might not know that the 10% was understood though.
So since you wrote the original post for this thread, I assume that means you feel that Drury’s NMC wouldn’t prohibit a buyout, correct?
Nope. NMC prevents demotion/trade, not buyout. Technically a buyout isn’t a “movement”.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
Does he have to agree to the buyout, or is there a clause in his contract that gives the Rangers the option?
Buyouts don’t technically have to be agreed upon, but it’s good practice to at least let the player know.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 1:34 PM EST up reply actions
maybe drury will retire? :)
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by John Merrigan on Jan 21, 2011 2:47 PM EST up reply actions
Only if he’s like Naslund and recognizes when he can’t play anymore. Those are few and far between.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 4:27 PM EST up reply actions
Naslund was a class act doing what he did. Not many players will walk away from guaranteed money
by YouMe&Dupuis on Jan 21, 2011 4:37 PM EST up reply actions
i wouldnt walk away from 7 mil.. would u?
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
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Naslund knew he still cash a pay check back in Sweden too. Maybe if some starts the “Connecticut Hockey League” Dru will do the same.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 22, 2011 10:15 AM EST up reply actions
I highly doubt Drury would retire...
I think once Naslund left Vancouver, he knew he was done. That’s why he signed a 2 year deal. Drury signed a 5-year deal for a reason… to play 5 years.
Unfortunately for Drury, his contract far exceeded what he could have possibly brought to the Rangers. He can probably still produce as he has in the past, but on this team he isn’t being utilized the way he has in the past.. and that’s not to make excuses for him, he just doesn’t fit the direction of the team.
Drury in all likelihood still wants to play and feels like he can contribute. If the organization approached him about a trade, I think that he’d listen… if it was to a contender and someplace he thought he and his family would be happy. At this point last year I doubt Sather would have considered doing that, but now I don’t see why not.
Hollow voice?
How much leadership can a guy with 4 points provide? I understand he was a decent player and is a veteran who has been around. But when you’ve got a lot of young guys that have a lot to prove, do they really want to hear from the guy who can’t do much on the ice, where it counts? I don’t hate Drury, just his contract like everyone else around here. Pass the C on to Callahan, Staal or Dubi. Drury’s just taking up a spot where we could put someone that could produce (at least when we get healthy).
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I’m tired of this 4 points bullshit. Drury has actually played really well in extremely limited minutes, with primarily the 4th line this year. The best players in the league aren’t going to produce at a very high clip in that position. I’d like to have seen Drury score on some of his chances, sure, but at least the guy is producing. I consistently see people on here talking about how good Fedotenko has been because hes potted himself a few points this year, but they somehow forget about the 900 free goals he has somehow missed this season. It’s a joke that you love one, but jump on the other because he doesn’t get the minutes and or time with our best players.
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by Jim Schmiedeberg on Jan 21, 2011 5:56 PM EST up reply actions
I'm tired of people defending him, he brings nothing to the table, end of story!
How good is a captain that can’t lead by example? What has Chris Drury done to make an impact on the team? We all talk about clutch goals but ut seems that every clutch goal he has scored he did against us when he played in buffalo. He has been dreadful and he certainly does not inspire his teamates like a guy such as Messier did. We do not need a 7 million dollar player whose most tangeable asset is penalty killing or faceoffs, both of which could be found in cheaper players. He has become a liability to the Rangers. Unfortunately his contract is awful, both the terms and salary. Fed’s may not be an offensive dynamo but at least there is some scoring potential, his salary is not crippling us, he has produced prabably on par with what was expected out of him.
let's say
that they either strip dru of the C, or he relinquishes it … the next question is, who should get the C, and who would the alternates be?
or do they go the Renney route and go without a C , like a couple years back. not sure if i remember correctly during that time period of no captaincy, is when we went the depest into the playoffs? or was jagr captain at that point ?
I would put it on Hank
I don’t think the kids are ready. I think having Cally in the mix was fine when he was third in the pecking order, but now it’s Cally and Staal, and they’re just too young and inexperienced. Everyone knows this team lives and dies with Hank. He’s gonna have the camera in his face with or without the C.
Hank in charge lets the young leadership on this team develop. Keep rotating through the A’s with some younger players. I think there’s alot of guys who could be potential leaders, and we need all the leadership we can get, so why limit it. You’ve already got Cally and Staal with letters, atleast temporarily, and other young guys like Dubi and Boyle who seem ready to step up – why not let them ALL show what they have to offer, without feeling like they’re stepping on toes. Hank is at the top of the heap, and the rest are all there with him.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 11:51 AM EST up reply actions
Goalie as captain
That’s a little tricky. Obviously he is the biggest reason we win games, but he’s not skating all over the ice, taking/giving hits and cycling. Not sure he’d be the best voice to get guys going when they need it. That scenario didn’t work out so well up in Vancouver last year with Luongo.
Manning lobs it, Burress alone, touchdown New York!
For the empty net, Mark Messier... do you believe it?! Do you believe it?! He said we will win game 6 - he has just picked up the hat trick!
I agree
But I think other then him, you’re making a leadership decision too soon with alot of the young guys. I think Hank is not shy about letting the guys know when they look like shit out there during the game, and some of the saves he make are bigger then any hit. Not like Drury’s play does much to inspire anyway.
Hank on top wouldn’t be as much about Hank being the Captain, but rather about keeping the spot open until someone knows they deserve it.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 11:59 AM EST up reply actions
No goalie captain. I want Hank focused on goaltending. Let Cally have it, hell I’d give it to Prust too because I think he can handle it.
Stepan?
In the vein of Crosby, Toews…
Not advocating it, (Callahan would probably be the best fit) just want your opinion.
In time, he probably will be considering how calm, collected, and mature he is in his interviews. But he’s still learning his way, need to give him time.
Stepan is not in the same league as Toews and Crosby right now.
In accordance with what George astutely said a ways down, your team captain’s are also the guys who can speak to the officials, and are usually your first outlet to the media. When you look at this team, I personally have to think Callahan has to be that guy. While Dubi has made great strides, he still shows glaring signs of immaturity at times (Montreal game for instance), while Cally just works hard, never complains, and has earned plenty of respect around the league.
League rules stipulate that you can’t have the C on a goalie. You can make him a symbolic captain, but someone else needs the C.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
Exactly
It would mean no one was wearing the “C” on the ice, but we could use three “A’s”, and as I suggested above rotate through who wears them. Use them as a reward for good play, or to acknowledge players getting things done on a big team.
Hank is the ONLY guy on this team right now I think would a decent option. Even if we only kept it that was for a couple years, it would let us figure out who the REAL leaders are on this young team and find someone who can fill the roll, and is ready to, rather then just handing it to guys. Hank is everything we seem to want our captain to be. He works his ass off night in and night out, he’s a “home grown” ranger, and one of the best players in the league. If it’s not him, I think we need to find someone from outside to bring in and fill the roll.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
nope…who are they…never heard of them ever in my life
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It took them 30 years to implement the forward pass and 70 to mandate helmets thus making all hockey players who wear helmets and visors as well as goalies who wear masks and pads all wimpy cry babies
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by Kevin Power on Jan 21, 2011 12:09 PM EST up reply actions
But they're all pretty young and inexperienced
I think Dubi’s game and demeanor is closest to what we’re looking for, but I think all three still have enough on their plate as it is. Give them time and let them grow into the poisition, rather then thrusting it at them. As I said above, I think Boyle, Staal, and as a dark horse, even MDZ could be GREAT leaders, but no one on this team is a Dustin Brown, ready to to the reigns and run so young.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 12:13 PM EST up reply actions
You have got to be a troll from Lighthousehockey or something. There’s no other way to explain your keyboard-diarrhea.
What are you talking about
Let’s take a look at your suggestions
Cally – I don’t deny he has potential as a team leader, and his work ethic is a great way to ‘lead by example", but I think personality wise it would be alot like what we’ve got from Drury. I’m not saying he’s the wrong choice down the road, but taking the C from Dru and giving it Cally seems like it would lack any real change in attitude, or create any short term spark.
Prust – This is a MUCH longer shot then anything I’ve suggested. I like Prust alot, but unless he became one of those guys who made a name for himself as a “spark plug” for a couple of Cup teams, I don’t see it being realistic. Prust plays hard and isn’t scared to mix it up, but there’s not a ton of talent in his game, and he hasn’t come off as a guy who WANTS or even enjoys the spotlight
Dubi – This seems like the most logical choice – he’s got a great skill set, he plays hard, he’s not afraid to mix it up, and he seems to have a pretty outgoing personality and isn’t afraid of the spotlight. Dubi is just getting through some of his own issues with consistency and focus, it seems better to let him focus on the game without the weight of the C on his shoulders.
So, as I said above, all 3 COULD be great options down the road, but NONE of them seem like a good fit at this point. How is that “keyboard-diarrhea”
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
I’m attributing that term to your whole patch of posts regarding this matter.
Hank is the ONLY guy on this team right now I think would a decent option. Even if we only kept it that was for a couple years, it would let us figure out who the REAL leaders are on this young team and find someone who can fill the roll, and is ready to, rather then just handing it to guys.
and
bq. If it’s not him, I think we need to find someone from outside to bring in and fill the roll.
Who the real leaders on this team are? I think that’s already been established the past couple of seasons. And if they’re not going to give it to Hank…we should venture into the trade/FA market to find a captain…when we’ve got captain-material in guys like Cally, or Dubi…?
And since you mention Dustin Brown, please tell us what it is he does that makes him ready “to take the reigns” at such a young age vs. our guys.
On Brown, he I’d say he was the right fit at the right time. His development was moving along at a steady clip, and when Blake left he was a ready for the role, and what the team needed.
I’d argue that we HAVEN’T determined who the real leaders are, and here’s why. We’ve struggled with our consistency. Aves and Hank had to throw player only meeting last season it got so bad, and we saw 2 games of fire from the guys and more of the same. Jody Shelley showed up at the trading deadline and was praised for “coming in and being a leader”, so their must have been some type of void to fill. Then in the beginning there was the comments from Dubi about the “leadership groups” in the locker room the season before.
I won’t argue with you that there are guys with potential in the system, but as I’ve said, I’m not sold that they’re ready. I think we need to find a bridge to make sure that we’re making the right move. With all these young players, who we seem to want to keep in our system for the forseable future, it seems easier to give the situation some time, rather then be forced to ride out another bad choice.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 4:22 PM EST up reply actions
Ok, I understand what you’re saying. Just for reference, the Kings are in a free-fall right now, so I wouldn’t go trotting out Brown :-)
I see your point though, but Mattyice had a suggestion that I’d seem more inclined to agree with. We shouldn’t really look outside the team IMO, because you can’t just bring a guy into a locker room and immediately have him earn the team’s respect. Maybe that stuff flies when it’s Messier, but it’s obvious Drury had no effect on anything (and he was touted as a superb leader).
Perhaps it’s best to not have a captain. Instead of forcing it on one of our guys, or forcing somebody else onto the team like they did with Drury, just have 3 assistants, and let somebody come into the role. I don’t think the organization would allow it though compared to say a small-market team.
I’m seeing Hank as top as being pretty much the same as not having a captain named. Nobody wears the “C” on the ice. Hanks going to be out there all the time to “lead by example” and from what we’ve seen of him on the ice, it seems he’s not afraid to speak to his mind to the team – so I don’t really think anything would be changing.
By naming Hank “Captain” there’s not a vacancy though. There’s no rush to fill the void. In a few seasons, I could see him giving it up the way Luongo did, when one of the other guys are ready. so we can have an acting captain.
In the meantime I like everything about the message the move sends to the team. If he wasn’t a goalie, Hank would be the perfect choice. He plays with a ton of heart, works his tail, he’s a “home grown talent” and he’s one of the THE BEST in the game at what he does. I think that the emotion Hank shows is the polar opposite of Dru. Hank expects to stop every puck, and takes it personally when he doesn’t. I think that type of leader is EXACTLY what we need right now. Think of how often we come out slow and Hank keeps us in the game. If everyone came out like he did, we wouldn’t be in those situations. I not sure that we have anyone else on the team now who can bring that fire, which is why I suggested going outside the team, althought I would rather see us find someone from within.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 22, 2011 10:28 AM EST up reply actions
You kind of shot your argument there with that dark horse
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For the empty net, Mark Messier... do you believe it?! Do you believe it?! He said we will win game 6 - he has just picked up the hat trick!
The issue with MDZ has been his cockiness
The kid seems to think he’s invincibale, he wants to skate through 5 guys and score, he thinks he can make every hit, win every puck, and thread the needle on every pass. He’s gotta reign it in a little bit and figure out what he can or can’t do, but that sort of self-confidence can be a huge asset if you’re gonna lead a team. Like everything else on MDZ – it’s all part of this UNREAL skill set, if we can get someone who can help him tap into and apply it to the NHL game, he’s gonna be the biggest success of our system.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
give it up already
Enough about Del Zotto….he is not even a Ranger right now. He’s been a massive disappointment this year—just accept it already, your arguments about him are bordering on insanity right now.
And congratulations—you’ve topped yourself today by calling for Lundqvist to be the captain. That even edges out all your posts clamoring for Kovalchuk in the off-season.
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jan 21, 2011 3:16 PM EST up reply actions
I apologize
I forgot page 1 of “Greifi Griffie Talking Hockey” – it’s not about what YOU think, it’s about your “BA BA BA” being in unison with the rest of the herd
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 3:56 PM EST up reply actions
And should I take that as your vote for “Trade DelZotto” ?
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 4:23 PM EST up reply actions
I’ve never said anything like that about Del Zotto….I called for him to be brought back later this season after he grows up a little bit. I’ve said repeatedly that it is mystifying that you praise DZ to the skies while bashing Marc Staal. And it’s become funny how you still call this kid a superstar when he’s obviously a struggling NHL player at best right now.
As for the herd remark—because I don’t make stuff up like you or Eklund, does that mean I follow the herd? I piss off people about as often as anyone not named Buck on this site.
Let’s go over some of your finer points as a poster—you claim all-star defenseman Marc Staal sucks; you advocate naming a European goaltender as captain of the Rangers in a league that prohibits netminders from being captain; you continually post near-impossible trade scenarios for the Rangers; and you attracted national scorn for this blog with your series of ridiculous posts regarding the Rangers and Ilya Kovalchuk.
Anything I’m missing here? Let me know.
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jan 21, 2011 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
Why does being Henrik being European matter for a captain?
You usually want a skater as captain so that he can talk to the officials, so the goalie part makes sense. But Lundqvist’s nationality is irrelevant. He’s fluent in English just like most Europeans
Easy there Dar….didn’t mean to imply that it mattered like you are saying…all I meant was that it’s doubly unusual for a captain to be a European and a goaltender, given that only 6 captains in the NHL are European.
Jagr wasn’t exactly the most popular captain the Rangers have had, either…so the Rangers’ track record with European captains is not as solid as the Detroit Red Wings or Ottawa Senators….which would make the move of naming Ludqvist captain about as likely as Lawrence Taylor playing forward for the Rangers.
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jan 21, 2011 5:23 PM EST up reply actions
Re Jag's....
The guy put up the numbers as opposed to Dru…um…..not
I don’t claim Staal “sucks”, I have said there’s parts of his development that make me a big unsure about him reaching his potential.
I’ve gone through my rational for supporting Hank in depth throughout this whole thread, so I’m not inclined to do it again just for you, but I think I’ve supported it with more then enough sound reasoning. As opposed to your jusitification of “only 6 teams have done it before”.
As far as my “impossible” trade scenerios, I’ve made clear in all them that they were simply off day, “food for thought”, discussion topics. If you want to attack peoples trade posts, there’s a pile of them suggesting we send out our trash for someones elses top player everyday. My suggestions are all VERY balanced, and most importantly address our biggest need (top end talent) and offer something in return that the other team might want. Are the players I’ve suggested being “shopped” ? No, and I don’t deny this. However, the type of player we NEED to bring in isn’t going to be shopped by their team. However, using our abbundance of young, affordable, supporting talent, I think we can create some options that might be appealing to other teams.
Regarding the idea that I “attracted national scorn for this blog with (my) series of ridiculous posts regarding the Rangers and Illya Kovalchuk” that the worst thing you’ve come up with yet. Really? Am I, or anyone on this blog, supposed to be insulted by the opinion of Ryan “Listicle” Lambert. The guys a hack. What’s he do over at “Puck Daddy” beside pick up Greg Wyshynski’s dry cleaning? He puts up all those “listicles” cause that’s all he has time to write between mating greg’s socks. If you’re that big of a Lambert fan, I can’t believe you even have time to read my posts. I mean he’s just a fountain of hockey insight, how can have time to do ANYTHING other then soak it all in??
by BuckarooClub on Jan 22, 2011 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
Lambert is a fool, too bad he made you look like one too…..
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jan 22, 2011 1:53 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t recall Lambert making me look a fool…
by BuckarooClub on Jan 22, 2011 5:47 PM EST up reply actions
Lundqvist for captain, Del Zotto for captain and the HHOF…..your suggestions are so laughable and without reason….how’s that Duncan Keith trade working out? How’s Kovy working out for NJ?
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jan 22, 2011 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
Am I arguing with Glen Beck?
You twist facts to START an arguement, then miss in every direction, and still keep lobbing more BS.
Thought you might like READ the post the referenced a FICTIONAL Duncan Keith trade. Hmm what did I say about trading for Duncan Keith. I know, let’s pull up the section in a blockquote in case you can’t figure out how to use the link.
In a completely fictional move, that I’m not saying would happen, but is strictly to demonstrate what I’m talking about, so everyone doesn’t turn this into “why do you want to trade Staal” thing – I’d suggest trying to move Staal and prospects/picks for Duncan Keith. Keith would clearly be our top guy, and someone the rest of the D would have no problem looking to for help. He’s still young, and will be part of our team for years to come. From the Hawks perspective Staal would be able to step in and contribute immediatly, while giving a cash strapped team roughly 2 mil in cap relief. (and we could cover that extra 2 mil coming back by demoting Todd White).
OH YEAH … Look at that. Gotta get you a fact checker Greifi. Or maybe THIS would help. Although, if those cards work as well as they say they do, Lambert columns probably won’t seem as good as they used too.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 22, 2011 5:57 PM EST up reply actions
Just so you don’t think I’m ignoring your other “points”
LUNDQVIST AS CAPTAIN – If you’ve been reading my comments you should be able to find all the support I’ve given for this idea or my “reasons” for why I think Hank would be a good fit.
DELZOTTO – I never suggested him for the HHOF, i did suggest him for a “Dark Horse” captain selection down the road. I don’t get how suggesting that an extremely skilled 20 year old, who’s in the minors because he has an attitude that he can do anything, and can’t be stoppped, could POSSIBLY be a good captain DOWN THE ROAD is “laughable”.
Regarding Kovi – Kovi has 26 points, playing a position he HATED, on a team that’s had a rough season. I still think he’s a MUCH better player then his stat line shows right now, and still think he’s be a great fit NY with his $6.3 mil cap hit and an answer to our scoring woes.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 22, 2011 6:18 PM EST up reply actions
Glenn Beck? Fuck off, Buck!
That is a pathetic defense for pathetic posts. I’m done with all of this. Go ahead, spew your bullshit, it’s all meaningless in the long run.
Seriously—if you want to waste everybody’s time with speculative nonsense about your favorite players on the Rangers, go ahead…you ain’t getting a rise out of me any more, this is all just so fucking tiresome.
And lastly—you would think Kovi is still a great player….he’s been a loser his whole career, and now he’s helping to drag down one of the more consistent winning franchises in the NHL. That really shows what’s up with your hockey knowledge.
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jan 22, 2011 8:35 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The people with the letters don't have to be the primary leaders.
There are plenty of vets/vocal players around the league that don’t have the letters. The captaincy often goes to the high draft pick/leading scorers as opposed to the true leaders of the team.
That’s in part because the captain’s job on the ice is to be the liaison to the officials, and the guys that are out there the most are your best vehicle to get your message across.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 21, 2011 12:18 PM EST up reply actions
Moreover, leaders are gonna lead, regardless of whether or not they have a letter on their jersey.
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by red army line on Jan 21, 2011 12:34 PM EST up reply actions
I don't disagree with that
But we’ve had some conflicts off the ice with leadership, so I’d rather see us find someone we all can agree with on top and let the rest of the voices be heard as necessary.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 1:30 PM EST up reply actions
With top picks, those are the guys you gonna live or die with regardless
So they obvious candidates for the job. Also, they aren’t usually guys that have usually had to ‘develop" atlot at any level they played, so they’ve been the go to guy for other teams they’ve been on coming up as well.
The thing that I think makes us different, is that while we’ve got a lot young talent coming through our system, none of it was a true “top pick”. I guy we were taking to be the future of our franchise, so you’ve got a lot of voices, all at the same place in the pecking order.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 21, 2011 1:34 PM EST up reply actions
I like the idea of holding off on a Captain for a bit...
I feel like having 3 A’s fits the Tortarella ideology really well – no Captain, just a group of hard-working soldiers with a few stand-out leaders. Until there’s one guy who earns the Captaincy, there’s no need to tack the added pressure onto someone plate.
I can agree with that wholeheartedly. As long as Drury steps down. Stripping somebody of a captaincy mid-season can create locker-room issues.
Hes not stepping down, nor is he being stripped. Fact is he is a good captain for this team. His skill is declining, but he’s still a mentor for this team this year. The team looks up to him, and the coaching staff and front office trust him.
Lack of production does not correlate to bad captain.
by Dave Shapiro on Jan 21, 2011 4:30 PM EST up reply actions
Has nothing to do with ‘production’. When a player goes from ‘Captain Clutch’ to a 4th line utility player in the matter of a few seasons while raking in 7 million, I’m sorry, but I start to question that player’s desire and work ethic. Has nothing to do with production, otherwise people would have been calling for Gaborik to be captain after last season.
If he wasn’t making 7 million, captain or not, his ass would be in Hartford.
There's no logic in stripping captaincy from a veteran player with a bloated contract
If this is done, he’s effectively become a pariah on the team. Columbus was in a similar dilemma with Luke Richardson a few years back, had to sit him fairly regularly until eventually traded.
I also see no logic in Drury relinquishing it. What is the message then? “I’m useless and taking up a roster spot?”
Either way, this is a no-win situation. Quite frankly – and if if he didn’t have the bloated contract – no one would have in issue with Drury as a 4th line player or PK situational player.
This was obviously a poor signing…although clear not as bad as Redden’s. Although a toss-up with Gomez (as Drury produced two solid, first two seasons with NY).
Next captain would clearly be someone already wearing an ‘A.’ It’s either Callahan or Staal.
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Lot's of 'clears' and 'although's' - Looks like I found my Words of the Day for Saturday.
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Full creidt for this goes to George Ays
He posted this in another thread, but it fits in perfectly here:
I’m one of the bigger Drury defenders around here, but he looks completely lost, and his biggest positive trait, his defensive skill, is waning as well.
He’s been given shit for zone starts (38% offensive), but:
He’s getting massively outshot (worst on the team now that Todd White is gone)
He hasn’t drawn a single penalty in 18 games (a sign that defenses are finding it easy to keep up with him)
The PK has been at it’s worst with him on the ice (65+ shots against per 60 minutes (just under 9 more than the next highest, Callahan, and 15 more than Boyle)
His points/60 at ES (1.34) is the worst since behindthenet started posting that data.
He’s missed the net on 10 of his 28 ES shot attempts (35.7%, worst on the team)
So he’s failing the eye test, he failing the microstat test…I don’t see what he’s bringing to the table right now. Sure, I suppose he presents a better game than Weise, but if Newbury’s going to keep winning faceoffs (20-9 so far), then the one last gasp Drury has to hold onto is also replacable.
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by Jim Schmiedeberg on Jan 21, 2011 11:35 AM EST reply actions
Numbers don't lie
Dru served his purpose for leadership and how to do it the right way, while contributing a bit on the ice. At this point, I think the torch has to be passed on to the core of the team now.
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nice work george
"We play them a few more times this year"
- Brian Boyle
by John Merrigan on Jan 21, 2011 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
Shorter George E. Ays:
Drury sucks. And is being paid a shitload of money for it. The only time that much money should be paid for that much suck is if every man in the garden gets a complimentary blow-job with every beer purchased.
Is that part of the MSG renovations?
by MyFavBaseballSquadron on Jan 21, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That’s the angry, watching the game at a bar version of the analysis. Does work just as well.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 21, 2011 12:07 PM EST up reply actions
I could actually picture you sitting around a bar with a bunch of fans watching the game. Somebody bitches at one of the players for doing something stupid, and you quickly dig up some stats on your iPhone, shove it in their face, and say “see, he’s not really THAT bad!”.
Love your analytical stuff though. Always puts things in perspective.
How did you know I bought an iPhone this week?
The bar version of me rarely uses statistics, my memory sucks.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 21, 2011 12:13 PM EST up reply actions
where did you originally post this george, i want to link it
"We play them a few more times this year"
- Brian Boyle
by John Merrigan on Jan 21, 2011 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
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by George E. Ays on Jan 21, 2011 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
thanks
"We play them a few more times this year"
- Brian Boyle
by John Merrigan on Jan 21, 2011 2:45 PM EST up reply actions
only if they come from stepMom and/or stepSister
"If I had the Rangers payroll, I'd make the playoffs every year" Glen Sather
It took them 30 years to implement the forward pass and 70 to mandate helmets thus making all hockey players who wear helmets and visors as well as goalies who wear masks and pads all wimpy cry babies
In Prust We Trust
by Kevin Power on Jan 21, 2011 12:10 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I’m just waiting for one of you guys to do a Youtube remake of that ’Stacy’s Mom’ song. ’Stepan’s Mom’.
if i knew how i would
"If I had the Rangers payroll, I'd make the playoffs every year" Glen Sather
It took them 30 years to implement the forward pass and 70 to mandate helmets thus making all hockey players who wear helmets and visors as well as goalies who wear masks and pads all wimpy cry babies
In Prust We Trust
by Kevin Power on Jan 21, 2011 12:18 PM EST up reply actions
i still don't think a trade is completely out of the realm of possibility
"We play them a few more times this year"
- Brian Boyle
Why couldn't Gaborik be Captain?
Give him a shot, if they ever strip Dru’s C
MATTEAU!!!!! MATTEAU!!!!!!! MATTEAU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
he'd be the least logical choice
Imo, gabby doesn’t show those true leadership qualities that u need from a captain…u need a guy that others want to follow into battle night in and night out, gabby is just one, mostly silent, weapon
"If I had the Rangers payroll, I'd make the playoffs every year" Glen Sather
It took them 30 years to implement the forward pass and 70 to mandate helmets thus making all hockey players who wear helmets and visors as well as goalies who wear masks and pads all wimpy cry babies
In Prust We Trust
by Kevin Power on Jan 21, 2011 1:18 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
You gotta buy him out
I know he’s a great leader and all but the fact of the matter is that his salary is just way too high for what he brings to the table. He was injured most of the year and honestly … we played better without him i think. And it’s not like he was in the locker room for those games, and yet somehow we not only survived, but thrived. So, is his leadership really worth all that much when we have viable leadership with the young guys like Cally, Duber and Staal picking up the reigns? Not to mention Hank … i think he’s more of a voice in that locker room than people give him credit for, although i can’t say that for certain. And really, as much as i hate to say it, if you were on the team and he came up to you to impart some wisdom in the back of your head you’ve got to be thinking “this clown makes 7 mil a year to suck a$$hole … why should i listen to him?”. Not saying that’s a correct thought pattern, but it has to be there in some guys.
Bottom line, here’s the choice … what is more valuable? Drury and his cap crushing salary? Or 3.25 mil in cap space next year and then 5.38 mil the following year?
To me that’s a no brainier. Look at some of the players making 3.25 mil this year. Look at some of the players making 5.38 mil this year. There are a TON of good to great players that could be had with that money. One example that comes to mind is Dustin Brown … so basically by not buying out Drury you are telling me that you wouldn’t trade Drury for Brown? I know i would … in a second!
As for Gomez … I’ve always said, even before the trade, that if the Rangers were to trade either Drury or Gomez i wanted it to be Drury. Gomez didn’t get a fair rub in NY. He got signed to center Jagr … that didn’t happen cuz Jagr couldn’t keep up with Gomez. Look at what Gomez is doing with decent wingers … now imagine what he could do with Gabby … those two would have been great with each other. But at the same time Gomez got us more than Drury would have. When you really look at it, Gomez brought us Gabby, McDonagh, Prust and Cap Space (by trading and then not resigning Olli). Probably the best trade Sather has ever made.
anson carter for jagr :)
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
I have to admit, I like watching this board turn into a bunch of Drury-bashers. He’s been one of the most overrated players for a decade, and about time this becomes more widespread.
Anyway, we all know this a completely theoretical discussion. There is no chance that Drury doesn’t play out his contract here. The real question is going to be whether he is resigned, and for how much.
In the end, it’s a question about whether having Drury for one year at $7 million is better than having him for two years at $3.7 million and $1.67 million. It’s a tough call, and it’s hard to say if there’s a right answer.
Its not really a tough call at all if you focus on his real value. The question is can you replace his skills with an equal or better player for the delta between his buyout costs (3.7/1.67M) and the cost of acquiring that replacement. So can you find a 3rd/4th liner with 40 point potential (Im being generous) and leadership qualities (whatever the heck those are) for 3.7M? I’m guessing you could, and Im guessing it would be a younger player who can provide that talent now, and have more future potential.
Glen Sather is a Hockey Genius.
http://twitter.com/ThGeneralissimo
http://twitter.com/poplosertwit
by poploser on Jan 21, 2011 1:16 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
For what Drury brings, you buy him out, have a 3.7 cap hit, and can easily replace him with an AHL guy making 800k-1m. That extra 2.5 is extra raise money to spend on guys like Boyle, AA, Cally, Dubi.
by Caerid112 on Jan 21, 2011 2:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
another option
didn’t see anyone mention it and forgive me if someone did, but if drury is such a team guy, he could go the naslund route and retire. give him an assistant coaching gig on the whale to help develop players.
his contract isn’t a 35+ deal so all his dollars come off the cap…
and maybe boogard’s head issues will force him to retire too. sad for the guy, but would help the rangers cap space.
just being optimistic, but could happen
by brodeur hearts avery on Jan 21, 2011 1:38 PM EST reply actions
Sign me up!
I would love that solution … the only problem is Pride. Drury seems to have a lot of it and he doesn’t seem to think his career is over. Which is understandable. If the guy was making 2 or 3 mil then i wouldn’t even have a problem with him staying … but he doesn’t. He can still play in the NHL which means he wont retire.
this is what Drury should do
Redden too
do us all a big favor and f’n retire
heck Rangers fans would be so happy we will throw you a parade
now if they retire the money doesn’t go against the cap I am assuming?
by Archie Barberio on Jan 21, 2011 2:14 PM EST reply actions
I’m not sure about redden but if drury retires all of his money comes off the cap because he does not have a 35+ contract
"If I had the Rangers payroll, I'd make the playoffs every year" Glen Sather
It took them 30 years to implement the forward pass and 70 to mandate helmets thus making all hockey players who wear helmets and visors as well as goalies who wear masks and pads all wimpy cry babies
In Prust We Trust
Yup, it all comes off, but they’re also forfeiting anything left on the contract. It’s why what Naslund did (and look up Gil Meche from the KC Royals) is so respectable.
yeah
i know Meche did that but Naslund did that too for money? wow
wish Drury would f’n retire
by Archie Barberio on Jan 21, 2011 5:31 PM EST up reply actions
why would they retire. They receiving lots of money and they’re physically fit to play. Would you turn down 7million to play a game you love. Doesn’t even matter if you’re good or not. I don’t blame drury or redden at all for their contracts. You have to blame the guy who gave it to them. No one in their right mind would turn down that contract because they think they “wont” live up to their contract. And drury is not the type to just give up nor do i think redden give up. They just suck now and thats no their fault they’re getting paid to be bums.
if we can trade him and his ntc
we should trade him next year and pay half the salary????
Can’t cover player salaries in trades in the NHL.
Half of Avery’s salary is paid by the Stars because he was acquired through re-entry waivers.
Half of Jagr’s salary was paid by Washington because the Jagr trade to NY was before the lockout and the salary arrangement was grandfathered.
still can’t believe that Washington was paying Jagr the entire time he was here…makes that deal that much better
"If I had the Rangers payroll, I'd make the playoffs every year" Glen Sather
It took them 30 years to implement the forward pass and 70 to mandate helmets thus making all hockey players who wear helmets and visors as well as goalies who wear masks and pads all wimpy cry babies
In Prust We Trust
really?
i thought he was just a free agent
"If I had the Rangers payroll, I'd make the playoffs every year" Glen Sather
It took them 30 years to implement the forward pass and 70 to mandate helmets thus making all hockey players who wear helmets and visors as well as goalies who wear masks and pads all wimpy cry babies
In Prust We Trust
ahh ok…makes much more sense now
"If I had the Rangers payroll, I'd make the playoffs every year" Glen Sather
It took them 30 years to implement the forward pass and 70 to mandate helmets thus making all hockey players who wear helmets and visors as well as goalies who wear masks and pads all wimpy cry babies
In Prust We Trust
The rangers should not go after Richards, hey ranger fans have we not learned our lesson yet. Lets give another aging winger whose point production will be going down in the next season or two. For example look at the drury deal, still not convinced redden. Lets stay with our youth not another aging star.
+1 I'm happy to see this type of comment in contrast to the many proposing his signing
Once the black hole of Christmas’ past are off the books, the team should commit monies to what it deems its new core. Trading for younger talent (then re-upping based on performance) almost always make sense. Another Gaborik-size U/RFA contract, nope.
"...also I'll brush my teeth and remember to turn off the stars at night and put the hyena out." ERNEST HEMINGWAY
Exactly guys.
When you are a signing a vet you always overpay for their past success. I know nothing is guaranteed, but at least with a younger player that drop off is less likely. That’s why I would rather take my chances on the young core filling out the top six forward slots/ top four D slots (this already happened) and then rely on UFAs to fill out the roster as needed.
Richards will be too old to even come close to justifying his likely giant contract after two or three seasons. Unless he decides he is ok with a two year deal (not likely) I don’t want him. At least Gaborik was only 27 when he signed, Richards will already be 31.
i dont want richards. first priority is to resign all of our RFA’s and UFA’s.
now a lot of people believe that drury is a “great leader” or “great captain”. ive always wondered what u have to back this up. when he was injured and away from the team we seemed to be doing well.
after this season i would personally buy him out. i believe we could easily replace his talent with the 3+ mil we save from it. have dubi cally and staal the three A’s. :)
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Dave, good stuff here.
George same to you.
Now, with an insane playmaker (Richards) and Gaborik is a pure sniper, together, I see consistant scoring on a nightly basis. Now with that said, I don’t think we give him 7 million over 5 but more like 5.5 for 6 years would be more reasonable especially front loaded.
As for Drury… ugh, im done defending him he makes 7 mill per and has zero goals this year. Unacceptable.
Buy him out next year, it is the perfect solution honestly, as sad as that is to say.
by louielounz1 on Jan 21, 2011 9:00 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Drury
Try to convince him that his skills have eroded and that he should retire. If he won’t, either bench him permanently (like S. Marbury on the Knicks) or buy him out. He really isn’t good enough to deserve much ice time.
Steph was a different case
He was a nutjob (though, so was Isaiah Thomas).
Drury’s the captain of the team.
drury just cant wear the C anymore, and im sure he realizes it as much as we do
after the season it should shift
i don’t think they should ignore it and have no captain
i firmly believe ryan callahan should have the C on his jersey next year
he stands for everything this team has become, and will set the tone for everything this team has yet to accomplish
drury’s been a spectacular hockey player, and one of the most clutch in history, but let’s face it
it’s time to pass the torch
I listen to Enter Sandman before taking exams. I wear the exact same jersey every Giants game. The Rangers goal song goes off in my head when I achieve small successes in life.
HEN-RIK
by BombersGmenBlueshirts25 on Jan 22, 2011 3:36 AM EST reply actions
You know Sather is going to do something really stupid, he is due
like after Dru’s contract is up, they will sign him for half of that and proclaim victory for getting veteran leadership[ at a discount.
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