Mats Zuccarello And Carl Hagelin Making Statements
by Joe Fortunato on Oct 22, 2011 9:16 AM EDT
in New York Rangers Prospects
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PrintAfter the New York Rangers loss to the New York Islanders, John Tortorella elected to send forwards Mats Zuccarello down to the AHL. It wasn't a decision based on poor play, it was just a matter of Zuccarello not receiving enough ice time (he only played for four minutes against the Islanders) for his development.
While admitting that he was disappointed, Zuccarello said he was going to make it a point to get back with the big club as soon as possible.
That point was received last night. In his debut for the Connecticut Whale, Zuccarello buried two goals and added an assist for a three-point game.
Although it's only been one game, Zuccarello knows it's time to make his point. The young forward understands that he wasn't sent down based on anything he did wrong, which while frustrating, leave the door open wide for a return back to the big club.
Join me after the jump for more.
The Rangers' brass will be keeping a close eye on Zuccarello while he's with the Whale, especially if he keeps putting up performances like the one he had last night.
The other positive of the situation is that Zuccarello understands the situation. Here's what he said to Brian Ring of Howlings:
I'm here to show that I can be a player that can contribute offensively in the NHL," said Zuccarello. "That's everybody's dream down here, to play there, I've been there and I know I can play there, I just have to keep doing it here."
Also not to be overlooked is Carl Hagelin. Hagelin assisted Zuccarello's second goal, and is currently the team leader in points with three goals and two assists in five games.
He's one of the players I thought had the best shots at making the team out of camp, once training camp actually started. Hagelin has a quick shot, a nose for the net and has great vision as well. He's another player you can expect can see with the big club sooner rather then later, especially if he keeps playing like this.
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Just a matter of time.
Matts will be back up soon. He makes things happen offensively, he likes to use the body and he is not a liability on defense. I Notice 2 things though; 1. Torts has no confidence in him, and 2. it seems that Zuke is never passed to in the offensive zone. Evey time he gets the puck he has done it on his own. I am not comparing the SEL with the NHL, but when you look at MZA’s highlights he is extremely talented. Tort’s system is not conducive for MZA.
Look at Parenteau ! If MZA is ever let go (and I hope he is NOT) he will do very well in the NHL with a club that will give him 15-18 min. a game. Just to make it clear on another matter I do not like the way Tortorella coaches. He does not utilize his players to their strengths. A goal scorer is a GOAL SCORER! Torts feels that everyone of his forwards has to be a POWER FORWARD. This team will never go far in the play-offs with him at the helm.
+1 sorta agree
"It's far from done, but we did get something accomplished."-#19 B.Richards
by -19-AgainstAll on Oct 22, 2011 11:17 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
if Torts had no confidence in him he would have never played in the NHL. Torts has shown a tremendous amount of confidence in Zucc. He always has kind words and has found a way to work him into the lineup despite an extremely poor pre-season last year. Torts is moving him along at the right pace.
No, the problem with Zucc is precisely what he knows it is: he hasn’t been able to score consistently in the NHL. He will given time, but that is the key word, time.
d
Paranteau is garbage.
He would be the 8/9th forward on this team and not get ice time. He is playing with an 80 point center and legit 30 goal scoribg wing. That lines production is in spite of him, not because of him. He’s horrendous in his own zone and plays with a softness reserved for the likes of the Stay Puff Marshmellow Man and Pillsbury Dough Boy.
Not to mention I heard he prefers self gratification to intercourse, talk about being selfish. Can’t have a guy like that in the locker room.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 12:51 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
He seems to be producing with JT and Moulson.
Could he possibly produce with Gabs and BR?
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Well, than what’s the point of putting Stepan with them?
If anyone could produce, why not throw Rupp or Christensen there, and allow Step to center Wolski and MZA for a solid 3rd line?
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
He no doubt has the ability, however he was a Zero Factor on NHL sized ice in the preseason… the best games he played were when we were on our European Tour and were playing against sub-par competition on the bigger ice surfaces… When he’s played in the NHL he’s been easily pushed around…
I just don’t know if at his size currently he warrants a spot on the NHL Roster… He either hasn’t been able to fully convert to the NHL ice or he’s just not destined to be an NHLer…
He really doesn’t have the speed to compete at his height in the league, even the smaller guys like mike camellieri have a bit of bulk to them to help (not stop) them from being pushed off the puck, but cams has insane quickness along with a guy like St. Louis…
I just don’t see him ever being a force in the NHL…
@clalicata17
Zuccs I like him a lot. But the way the lines are structured he just doesn’t fit. That fourth line with Rupp on it just doesn’t work for Zuccs. He’s gotta play with skill players and right now we don’t have those players to surround him with the way our lines are best structured.
by CrazyRangerFan on Oct 22, 2011 11:02 AM EDT reply actions
Can you play a line of Wolski/Newbury/Zuccarello?
Not sure if Newbury has skills..could be EC in the pivot but i think that ship has sailed.
If they pulled a deal for a guy like a Dominic Moore-type to play with Wolski/Zucc it could work if they got 10 minutes a game. But first hint if trouble Torts nails them to bench…so one could easily say why bother thinking about it.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 11:11 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I would say throw EC as the pivot. But who knows, Im not a big fan of either EC or Wolski. But Newbury probably wouldn’t be a great line mate even a Dominic Moore type I don’t think would work. Zuccs needs to play with top 6 mentality and right now our top six is set, so I don’t see a spot open for him.
by CrazyRangerFan on Oct 22, 2011 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Problem is he needs some NHL production to build value. Not sure who will get excited if he puts up 30 point in 15 games with Fudgie.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 12:43 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I like zuccarello, but we have 7 forwards deserving more ES TOI
Stepan, Richards, Gabby, Pack Line, Boyle…not even considerin Wolski.
Good find by Sather but not for this team. Package him with MDZ, Christian Thomas and a 1st for Suter. Put Staal on LT Injured List and lets move forward.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 11:06 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
Bad trade. Suter is worth less than that. Thomas and a 1st rounder for a guy on a one year deal. Only done if we go on a cup run.
We are going to go to Philadelphia... and we are going to win.- Glen Sather
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Oct 22, 2011 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions
If Staal is out for the year, this deal or one similar to it gets done.
I’m not sold on Thomas..wings of the future (2012 & 2013) are krieder and jt miller top six and hagelin and bourque bottom six.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 12:39 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
They are not trading a first round pick for a rental player. You hypothetical trade is absurd.
by GAThingy on Oct 22, 2011 3:44 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
i don’t mind educating the masses, but you are making this a habit. I suggest you look around at what others think Suter would cost. Also, They wouldn’t do this without an extension in place. He would become part of the long term plans.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Can’t legally discuss an extension before owning the player.
So your deal is a bust before leaving the gates.
Eklund has come up with better trade ideas.
by teknics on Oct 22, 2011 6:40 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Thats right..because these things never get discussed offline between teams and agents when big money is involved.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions
To answer your original comment.
Nashville needs offense and Rangers would need to free space. You can nake the playoffs and a run with..
Suter/Girardi
Sauer/McD
Erixon/Eminger
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 12:41 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I think Nashville would move Weber before Suter
They got an extra year of RFA control over Suter, and in the Weber trade talk over the summer, the idea was that Weber’s money could be used to pay Suter and Rinne. I still think it takes alot more then what you’re talking about though. Figure the equivilant of the 4 first round picks they could get for him if they just let him walk at the end of the season, atleast. I think we can get them to take WW ontop of that though, since we would need to make space, and they would still need to hit the floor once they lost the Weber cap hit.
by BuckarooClub on Oct 22, 2011 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Avery Said
he would take the league minimum to play with the Rangers again. I would kill to dump EC n bring up Avery again for cheap
"It's far from done, but we did get something accomplished."-#19 B.Richards
by -19-AgainstAll on Oct 22, 2011 11:14 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
Unfortunately...
Barring injuries, never going to happen. Its personal issue with Torts, not hockey related.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 11:17 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
29 other teams
Passing up on him on re-entry waivers and when the Rangerd placed him on waivers to start the season suggests its not just Torts that has an issue with him.
by MyFavBaseballSquadron on Oct 22, 2011 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
If they picked him up they would have been liable for the entire 4mil salary.
There are a lot of good players in the NHL that teams wouldn’t pick up for 4 mil. Completely unfair logic.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Avery is a competent bottom six forward. His intangibles don’t carry the same value as they did three or four years ago, but his skills and skating are still there. Outside of the bench penalty and publicized issue wih Simmonds (which sealed his fate with Torts) he had a better camp than EC.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 12:30 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Exactly. Why is EC still here!?! Boggles my mind. He’s the most consistent player when it comes to being invisible.
by motherpucker on Oct 22, 2011 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Don’t be so hard on EC. I’m sure he worked the whole summer on his invisibility skill.
GET RID OF EC!!!
the dude sucks
Bruce Carter+Sean Lee=BRUCE LEE!!!!
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by Archie Barberio on Oct 23, 2011 3:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Not really. No one wants him for what his contract pays him. In NHL, yoiu can’t restucture a contract for less money either so his desire to come up for less won’t happen. Rangers also can’t risk reaclling him and having someone pick him up at half price and lkeaving the rangers to foot half his pay agaonst the cap.
by GAThingy on Oct 22, 2011 3:48 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I was arguing the point MFBS made about other teams passing on him.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
He hasn't been on re-entry waivers yet.
Aves would get picked up somewhere for 900k
by BuckarooClub on Oct 22, 2011 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions
It would cost 2 mil and the rangers would foot the other 2 mil. Why recall and risk having to pay a cap hit?
by GAThingy on Oct 22, 2011 3:51 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
The NHL is on record saying that...
Dallas is on the hook for 1.9875M no matter what. If someone picks up Avery on re-entry, we split half of the remaining 1.9875M (or whatever it is) with the recipient, a 50/25/25 split. Several sources including the NHL are on record confirming it.
He was placed on re-entry by Dallas
When the Rangers picked him up.
by MyFavBaseballSquadron on Oct 22, 2011 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions
That was a completely different deal
The arrangement was made in advance for the Rangers to take him when he was sent down. Avery made his comments, and Dallas had no intention of bringing him back after that. The Rangers worked it out to have Avery assigned to the Wolf Pack by the Stars, let him get back into game shape their and show that he could fit into the organization. Someone else certainly could have made the same arrangement with Dallas, but at that point you were talking about taking on a 4 year deal at $1.9 per and Aves was just off his suspension.
Avery, for the rest of the season at $950k is a great deal, and someone would take it.
by BuckarooClub on Oct 24, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
+1, agreed 100%
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
But would you accept the jail time?
Unless the police officer is a Rangers fan, then he would understand.
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by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 3:09 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Avery's not even worth it if HE paid Torts the league minimum...
I’m not saying EC is the answer either, but the two situations are not necessarily linked. They should both be let go, really, and WW, too, but of the 3, EC is the most responsible on D and the least of a headache, hence the outcome.
You really don’t think he’s work 500k?
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
I think if we gave zucc minutes and a decent line he would be great. lets dump wolski. he is a waste I think. he had some clutch goals last year but i haven’t seen him to squat but grab his nuts in pain. zucc was always a fireball on the ice. at least he did something anything for that matter. Try Zucc – Richards – Gaborik and you will see he will be skating circles around guys and getting Richards and gab the Puck. plus he’s got a good shot he will shoot as well and get the back of the net
"It's far from done, but we did get something accomplished."-#19 B.Richards
by -19-AgainstAll on Oct 22, 2011 11:23 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
I like Stepan a lot on that line though…
by CrazyRangerFan on Oct 22, 2011 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions
Why are people THAT down on Wolski? Okay, he isn’t a superstar. But the idea that Zucc is a better player right now than Wolski makes no sense to me AT ALL.
Wolski does not = EC. I think we should stop putting them in the same category.
d
Stepan plays hard every night and has clicked so far with Richards and Gabby.
Wolski is no slouch..but uneven effort, injuries and less noticeable chemistry with Gabby/Richards has him on the outside looking in.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 12:33 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Sure, but with Step on that line it only gives on 3 lines we can really use.
And in the preseason Wolski had just as much chemistry with BR and Gabs as Stepan does now.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
I would disagree from games we saw on TV. But it seemed like they did click during scrimmages.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 1:05 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
100%
Every fanbase is going to have a few players that will be scapegoats to fall back on.
Now that Drury, Rozi, and Redden are gone we have Wolski, EC, and MDZ. That’s all there is to it.
When Wolski comes back he should be placed on that top line. Why? Because Stepan is a center, and moving him to the third line will allow us to run 4 decent lines and not have BR and Gabby completely burned by game 60.
Especially if we bring MZA back. It allows us to have a 3rd line of Rupp-Step-MZA. Or perhaps pivot Christensen instead of Rupp.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Torts doesn't roll 4 lines and why tinker with Richards/Gabby
I like Stepan more at center but Torts is a guy who leans on top players. He has no problem with current top three lines getting all the ES time they can handle. If Pack line starts to produce.. i could give a crap about a 4th line of spare parts. Other than wanting Wolski for SO and maybe EC for the same reason.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 1:03 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
If Torts had four lines he trusts, then he would roll four lines. People put too much blame on Torts for not rolling lines or switching them too much or whatever. The man knows how to coach let him do his job. If I were in Torts’ posititon right now I wouldn’t play that fourth line much either…
by CrazyRangerFan on Oct 22, 2011 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree with those lines fitting Torts’ philosophy. I’m just criticizing his philosophy as a whole.
If you play these guys too much they are going to start to wear down.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
I hear you.
But they dont have the pieces for a fourth line with offensive flavor… easier to go old school 4th line with Avery/Newbury/Rupp combo. But Torts had that option and passed. Not sure Slats would like seeing Wolski being healthy scratch every night (like he is tonight).
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 3:07 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Well, we have the 4th line with the offensive ability (Feds-Boyle-Prust) were just missing that third line. Hopefully in the next few years, assuming Step stays on that top line, we could put some semblance of a line together with MZA/Kreider/Borque/Thomas/Hagelin.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
I’d also put Wolsky on the top line and build a line around Step. It would give the team four lines to roll and we would be rid of this current abomination of a 4th line.
GET RID OF EC!!!
Upgrading D takes priority..
The composition of 4th line will change as players develop with Whale over the season.
If Staal is out for season, moving spare parts for a top 4 is a must.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 3:44 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Why are we comparing EC n Zucc
look I’m not saying I don’t love Stepan there but I’d give zucc the try on first line. what gives wolski the right to be on that line? what was he like in pheonix? why did we get him for rosival? I’m not trying to hate any player on this team but face facts wolski has been out..and when he’s there not making a huge difference more that EC is on this team. When zucc is out there at least he tries to get the Puck and when he does, makes good moves. why are we putting zucc in the same category as EC?
"It's far from done, but we did get something accomplished."-#19 B.Richards
by -19-AgainstAll on Oct 22, 2011 5:32 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Read Torts pregame quotes in other thread..Wolski is still in the mix apparently.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Oct 22, 2011 7:13 PM EDT up reply actions
*do squat
"It's far from done, but we did get something accomplished."-#19 B.Richards
by -19-AgainstAll on Oct 22, 2011 11:25 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
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