The Role Of Sean Avery
by Joe Fortunato on Nov 14, 2011 8:09 AM EST
in New York Rangers Analysis
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Sean Avery had his best game as a member of the New York Rangers this season, scoring a goal in just over 10 minutes of ice time.
There are many who were criticizing John Tortorella over the use of Avery, but I think Tortorella has been smart with him. He's started him off slow, let his body get used to the grind of an NHL game, and has given him ice time when he deserved it.
Avery even told the media after the game that he "needed to play like that every night." It's been a progression for Avery, who started his time with the big club very conservatively, and has pushed himself to becoming more and more like the Sean Avery of old with each passing game.
Join me after the jump for more.
One of the biggest concerns about Avery was his penalties taken to penalties drawn statistic. And while I can't find a metic on how many penalties Avery has drawn, he hasn't taken a single penalty in his four games with the Rangers this season. In fact, his first penalty minutes of the year was after a fight with Zenon Konopka.
He drew a vital power play for the Rangers against Carolina, and has done a very good job being physical and getting under opponent's skin without getting himself a seat in the penalty box. The game against the Hurricanes specifically was vintage Sean Avery and that's a good thing for the Rangers.
Tomorrow's matchup with the New York Islanders should be another fantastic chance for the Avery to show just how much of an impact he can make with the team. Avery has generally saved some of his best games for matchups with the Islanders, and it should make Tuesday quite a bit of fun.
It could also prove that Avery is not just here to stay, but will make a consistent impact as well.
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Avery's Penalty Stats
And while I can’t find a metic on how many penalties Avery has drawn…
Here’s this season and the last four seasons of this metric (Individual Penalties Drawn/60 Minutes) I also included the Penalties Taken/60 as well.:
While the last two seasons have been by a minuscule amount, Avery has always drawn more penalties than he takes. This season, he is doing that very well, drawing 4.7 penalties every 60 minutes compared to, as you pointed out, none taken/60.
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I have no problem with penalties like fighting, it’s the BS calls the refs make because of their “league agenda” against Avery. Those are the ones that hurt the team so Avery has to be extra careful on how he plays which limits his effectiveness, in general.
Exactly. Avery is a ref magnet when he’s on the ice. He rarely if ever gets any benefit of the doubt. It definitely restricts his game. But if he can play smart like he did against the Canes, he can be a major asset to this team.
The funny thing about Avery too is
he is not at all dirty. He plays on that line, and he is certainly a pest and a nuisance, but I can’t ever remember him trying to actually hurt somebody, only to annoy them. You have goons like Mat Cooke running around taking head shots and Avery is the guy the NHL is focused on because he made some sloppy second jokes and because he face guarded Brodeur on a 5-3 a couple years ago (which was brilliant, btw, don’t go down to men if you don’t want somebody fucking with your goalie, I thought it was crazy that the rule change came in next day, obviously the Devils were at a disadvantage because of that, they were down 5-3. A 5-3 PP is the only scenario where Avery could have even tried anything like face guarding a goalie without hurting his team).
you guys are right. He really isn’t a dirty player after all is said and done. It’s the off-ice comments that get the league pissed off evidently. but for some reason when a guy lands a headshot that either ruins a career or puts the player out for months or years then they have no problem with it. go figure.
Such BS...
While JT may be bringing along Sean the right way or not, I was incensed that Torts couldn’t find it in himself to actually say something more than:" Well, he played better…" after the game.
Played better? How about: “Nice freakin’ individual effort on a cross-bar roofer of a shot and nice job drawing 2 key PIMs from hard work w/o all of the nonsense?” The fact is, if Dubi had not scored such a sentimental gaping open net, first goal, Sean would’ve been a top 3 star apparently just from “playing better”?!
Believe me, I admittedly have been a major Sean-basher, but that performance was worthy of way more than what JT had to offer up. How else does JT explain moving him up to the 2nd line, for goodness sakes?
Yet another example of why this “coach” – reg ssn win streak in November or not – is just plain wrong for this team. :(
When have you ever heard John tortorella start gushing over his players like a little school girl?
That doesnt make him a bad coach, what would avery’s incentive to keep playing that way be if he thought Torts suddenly fell in love with him?
He doesn’t even talk about Girardi that way.
Good coaches always want more so they won’t be standing around celebrating 1 goal in game 15 of reg season.
Get a grip.
by teknics on Nov 14, 2011 9:13 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Nevermind the fact that you have no idea what torts actually said TO Avery, rather you’re going on what he said to the media….
by teknics on Nov 14, 2011 9:24 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Exactly, if a player is looking for compliments from what is said to the media he needs to rethink things.
by Zuppa Di Pesce on Nov 14, 2011 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
Personally, I could care less...
…what Torts said privately or what Sean thinks.
I’m posting here what I think, and I think he should’ve been more emphatic in his praise, plain and simple. And not necessarily gushing, either, just not clearly holding back saying something appreciative b/c he may or may not have to put pride aside. :(
by mgweissman on Nov 14, 2011 7:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Have you ever seen Torts on the bench smack players on the back after they make excellent plays? I have. I’d guess that what Torts says to the media and what he says to his players behind closed doors are two different things. I’ve never heard players (current or former) say anything negative about Torts’ coaching style. His players love playing for him. That was a big reason why the Rangers had a leg up on other teams for Richards as a FA.
Yes I have seen him do that. Just last game in fact. I’ve also seen him humiliate individual players on the bench.
I agree re: former players view of Torts (although I’ve never heard the “love” part), but the fact that players who currently play for him here don’t say anything bad about him is nice, certainly, but then again, nobody on NYR said a lot of negative things about Keenan WHILE he was coaching either, but the s*** surely flew after he left. I’m not saying Torts is anywhere near as maniacal as Mike was, but this locker room is primarily a very young, loyal group of professionals, and it is in their best interests to “tow the line” as far as organizational decisions and coaching strategies vs. publicly saying anything negative.
And while alot was made by the media of BR’s relationship with Torts when he signed, he rarely if ever brought it up unprompted. The reasons he came to the Rangers, as Brad himself outlined them, were playing in NYC, playing for an Original Six team, the core group that’s already here, and to a lesser degree, ALL of the contract terms, esp. considering he was offered more cash elsewhere. That’s not to say Torts being here wasn’t a “nice to have”, but the fact remains, had Torts been the coach of Columbus, for example, on July 1st, Brad would NOT have been clamoring to go play there. Overall, it was a factor, but very low on his priority list.
You seem to be making a lot of assumptions. How do you know any player is “towing the line?” And from what I’ve seen from Brad Richards so far in his public comments, he’s very low key and not one to express all of his thoughts and feelings. I think the fact he came to NY for less money speaks for itself. If he didn’t like playing for Torts and didn’t think Torts was a good coach for him to be successful, I highly doubt he would have come here, Original 6, NYC or not. By the way, a lot of players had negative things to say about Mike Keenan after playing for him. I’ve never heard anything of the like from Torts’ former players.
looks like you made just as many assumptions
probably more, actually.
actually, there isn't really one single thing in your post,
that wasnt an assumption
But the other poster’s comments weren’t loaded with assumptions? All assumptions? And what assumptions did I make exactly? My remarks with respect to Richards were inferences, not assumptions.
None of us know what Torts said to Avery, so that’s a moot point.
And he has gushed about players to the media before. He has done it with Richie, Cally, and Girardi this season so far.
I do believe that Torts is a good coach for this team however.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Excellent point!
Considering JT has done it with others, it just rubbed me the wrong way when he couldn’t find it in himself to do it in Avery’s case. That’s all.
Regardless, I can’t believe I’m actually advocating for Sean, period. Doesn’t take away how well he played last game. Let’s hope it continues. :)
i agree with both you and moshe.
i like torts for this team, but it does bother me how he seemingly can’t say anything positive about Avery, even when he was arguably the best player on the ice, because of his pride.
i'm pretty sure the incentive for players to play well
has nothing to do with what a coach says in a press conference. It probably has a lot more to do with individual pride, the want to win, and the responsibility of going hard for your teammates.
Avery's metrics don't take into account that he never gets the benefit of the doubt
That goes for when he’s fouled and when he’s given a penalty. He is still penalized whenever it is close and doesn’t get any calls unless he’s mugged. But I guess that’s all part of the deal.
by It may HAVE to Last a Lifetime on Nov 14, 2011 9:18 AM EST reply actions
Of course they take it into account. Either he draws a penalty or he doesn’t. It’s not a measure of “penalties he should’ve drawn.”
His value is hurt by the reputation he had a hand in creating. That’s a him problem.
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by George E. Ays on Nov 14, 2011 9:36 AM EST up reply actions
no, his value is hurt because
refs find it necessary to officiate nhl hockey differently for sean avery then they do for other players in the nhl, which is a them problem. Avery scares people because he is smart and he has a voice, it would be fine if he were some stupid brain dead head hunter, but he isn’t, the NHL just doesn’t like the way he plays hockey, so they have different guidelines for how to officiate Sean Avery, which is a joke.
He's on an eternal hot seat
The position he’s in is one in which he doesn’t get a ton of minutes so he needs to kick serious ass when he’s in. What’s nice is that he’s always rested, so he’s got plenty of energy to skate hard. I love it.
Ah, Avery
I personally love his antics because they reflect a classic side of hockey that is really being squeezed out with a more sterile version taking its place. A lot of it was before my time, but my dad always told me about all the flamboyant personalities that were once in the league.
Again, It’s only my personal opinion because I appreciate showmanship in sports—I think along with elite skill and athleticism, it’s what makes professional sports so great. I love knowing I’m not watching robots play under the helmets, but actual people that I can relate to—sometimes I’m not sure when watching a Brad Richards or Marian Gaborik interview.
It goes beyond numbers. He’s so divisive because for the stat guys on this site, he doesn’t do much for the Rangers. For the anti-fighting, anti-shenanigan guys on this site, to quote Slapshot, “he’s a f*ckin disgrace!” But for the guys who “inexplicably” like Avery, he just appeals to them for an aspect of his game that more people appreciate than you think.
He plays hard, wears his heart on his sleeve and entertains. Obviously I’d be against calling him up if I didn’t think he could contribute to this team, but he’s proven that he can so far this season if he plays a certain way. It’s just refreshing to see a guy like him, who has professed his love for playing on the Rangers, play and play well.
To quote a much maligned contingent of Rangers fans:
AV-ER-Y! AV-ER-Y! AV-ER-Y !! lol
@btown46
by Town on Nov 14, 2011 11:54 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
This is why that big mouth Don Cherry pisses me off with his selective memory and hypocisy. He bashes Avery for his style of play and just about anything associated with him but seems to fail to remember how he coached his players back in the day. O’Reilly, Schmautz, Milbury, Wensink, Jonathan, Secord…those guys make Avery look like a choir boy.
He barely played in the first 3 games. But he played great in the 1st 2 periods in Game 4 so Torts rewarded him by playing him 4+ minutes in the 3rd with Richards and Fedotenko. That’s all we can really ask of Torts at this point.
He drew 2 penalties, all because of hard work. Scored a great goal, again, it was because of hustle. He also threw the puck into the zone right before Richards “empty net” goal. He was getting into it with other players, while not going to far. Looked like the Old Sean. Hopefully he can keep up this level of play.
I don’t think he should get 1st line minutes, but leave him on the 3rd/4th line and give them 10-12 minutes a night. It will definitely pay off. Sean with EC (Who I hate but lately, he has shown that he actually cares. At least putting in some effort). I like Deveaux but he’s to slow. Bring up Zuccarello or Hagelin. That would be a fast line that could also play in the offensive zone, while not being an issue defensively. They don’t need another 4th line. Boyle-Feds-Prust is basically a really good 4th line that gets 3rd line minutes (Because they deserve it).
AA-Stepan-Gaborik
Dubinsky-Richards-Callahan
Prust-Boyle-Feds
Avery-EC-Zuccarello/Hagelin
I look at that as 2 possible 1st lines (The top 2) and 2 3rd lines. Between the 1st 2 lines, you split 35 minutes. Play one 20 minutes a night (The line that is playing the best that night. Give them the ice time), and the other gets about 15 minutes. Then with the bottom 2, you split 25 minutes. If they are both going strong, playing good, give each about 12:30. One is better then the other, give them 15, the other 10. I know PP/PK switches it up but you get where I’m going.
Prust is banged up, so are some others. I feel like Boyle is playing with some nagging injuries. So a system like this will keep the players fresh. Instead of having some lines playing 25+ a night, some only 5. Utilize all 4 lines. They need to keep the top guys going strong. Last year Ryan Kesler was so hurt and banged up that, at times in the playoffs, he could barely play, he almost completely shut down (I know he also suffered a more serious injury) but we can’t let this happen to guys like Dubinsky, Callahan, Prust and Boyle (I’m not saying they are going to the Finals this year. I was just using that as an example). I love this current team. 6 wins in a row, and it doesn’t look like they’re going to stop any time soon. This could be a great season.
(I can’t believe I wrote that much lol.. Bored/waiting for a class.)
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by NYRangerFan718 on Nov 14, 2011 12:01 PM EST reply actions
He barely played in the first 3 games. But he played great in the 1st 2 periods in Game 4 so Torts rewarded him by playing him 4+ minutes in the 3rd with Richards and Fedotenko. That’s all we can really ask of Torts at this point.
He’s keeping the lines together in practice today too. Boyle w/ Duballahan, Feds and Avery with Richards.
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by George E. Ays on Nov 14, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions
I saw that! I like it. They said Prust was banged up, had some injuries so playing him on the 4th line will get him some much needed rest (Only playing 3 games in the next 9 days will also help).. Even though Boyle has struggled, I said before that a line of him and Duballahan would be good. Maybe it’ll get him out of his slump.
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by NYRangerFan718 on Nov 14, 2011 8:58 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe it’ll get him out of his slump
Boyle’s not slumping. Tortorella has made him the defensive faceoff guy, sorta like Drury last year, except much worse. He’s starting 8 out of 11 faceoffs in the defensive zone, which is one of the 10 worst rates in the league.
It’s really hard to generate offense when you have to go 200 feet to get it.
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by George E. Ays on Nov 14, 2011 9:26 PM EST up reply actions
So?
Stepan Anisimov Gaborik
Dubinsky Boyle Callahan
Avery Richards Feds
Deveaux EC Prust
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Although Avery might be moving up in the lines, I do like how EC tends not to bother me when he plays with Avery and Deveaux on the 4th line. His skill can be used on the powerplay and then he can play 4th line minutes during the game when he is much less effective. It reminds me of when the Islanders had Kip Miller, who only saw 4th line minutes and powerplay time.
Sounds good to me.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
There are a few people noticeably missing from this thread……
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
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