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Don't Blame Dolans for Rising Prices in Garden

Much has been made about how the forthcoming renovations to Madison Square Garden will raise ticket prices, even in those seats not immediately impacted by the renovation. As a result, many fans have been pointing the finger at the Dolan’s for raising ticket prices in order to pay for his renovation, screwing over the casual fan in the process. While there are many things Dolan should be castigated for (Isiah Thomas, his blues band,) in this case he is making an impersonal decision to respond to demand for access to sporting events.

Ranger fans have been some of the most loyal in sports, almost to a fault. Ever since 1992-93, over 18,000 fans per game have made their way to the Garden. Not only is demand high for a limited number of tickets, but there exists a new market for exclusive seating areas with upscale lounges and dining areas. Think the Delta and Champions clubs at Citi Field and the Legends boxes at Yankee Stadium. Exempting the luxury suites hanging from the ceiling, fans at the Garden are not privy to the modern amenities found at other stadiums both around the league and the metropolitan area. Sitting in the 300 level at United Center, I have easier access to a wider range of dining options and a bar than in the Club Seats at the Garden. If Madison Square Garden is not rebuilt, adding these amenities, then the Dolans would be leaving millions of dollars on the table. Not only would that be irresponsible form a business standpoint, it could jeopardize the ability of the Rangers to field competitive teams in the face of increasing competition for sporting dollars. While the Rangers will always be able to spend to the cap, imagine if the Dolans were unwilling or unable to eat Wade Redden’s whale of a contract while he spends his time in Connecticut?

While we all love to lob chants of "Kansas City" at the Fishsticks faithful, we really should be chanting "Brooklyn." The Islanders relocating closer to the center of the universe would increase the supply of hockey tickets in the immediate vicinity of the Garden, and depress demand for Rangers tickets amongst marginal fans and corporations. The Nets pending relocation will do this to an extent.

Star-divide

If what Ranger fans really want is a championship team, regardless of the price of admission, then it behooves them to have the Islanders as close as possible. While, as I previously pointed out, Ranger fans are notoriously faithful, the corporate clients are marginal fans that the renovated Garden is appealing to are much more likely to be bandwagon fans, following whatever New York team happens to be winning. With the Islanders only a 10 minute subway ride from the Financial District and 20 minutes from Midtown, the Dolans will be forced to put a competitive team on both the ice and the floor if they wish to keep their profits from fleeing to Brooklyn.

I understand that fans need someone tangible to blame and point their finger at as they are increasingly unable to afford to go to as many games as they’d like to. The real culprit here is the economic reality that a lot of people want to go to games, and the changing perception corporate ticket buyers have about what the experience at a sporting event should be. While I sympathize with fans who can’t make it to as many games as they’d like to, blaming the Dolans for this undermines real criticism of the management of this team.

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awesome name :)

and welcome to BSB!!

"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."

LET'S GO RANGERS!!!

by Moshe52792 on Mar 24, 2011 2:11 PM EDT reply actions  

“Redden’s whale of a contract,” that’s pretty good.

by J Block 2 on Mar 24, 2011 3:45 PM EDT reply actions  

Is Barclay Center big enough?

I’ve heard that it seats less than 15,000 for hockey, which doesn’t meet NHL requirements.

"He who gets the best players usually wins" - Bobby Bowden

by Russ on Mar 25, 2011 11:18 AM EDT reply actions  

I'm confused

What do the Islanders have to do with MSG? Why do the Islanders impact the decision to renovate MSG (as opposed building a new one at the Post Office)? Either way you get a facility with all the “amenities.” Why would the Islanders go to Brooklyn and move away from their fan base and into territory that is not noted for (Islander) hockey support 20 minutes away from the Rangers? Have you run the numbers on the renovation? Do you know how long it will take “the Dolans” to recoup the investment? Maybe they won’t be able to bury the next Wade Redden contract because the renovation costs cannot be made up in the short term?

This is a dopey post.

by It may HAVE to Last a Lifetime on Mar 25, 2011 11:28 AM EDT reply actions  

I agree

What True Blue NY Rangers fan cares about Club’s and Restaurants in MSG? You want to enjoy fine dining go t oone of the 100 restaurants around the Garden I don’t care if I had to sit on a milk crate and eat $hit on a Shingle it’s all about winning a Stanley Cup.

The reason MSG has lost it’s luster is due to the emenities your praising Dolan about, you don’t sound like a real Rangers fan to me

by SISHAMROCK on Mar 25, 2011 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly, other than a reference to the Italian hero, I’ve never heard anyone say they’d prefer to eat the overpriced Garden food as opposed to a restaurant in NYC.

Does anyone eat the Sushi at the 100 level?

Please, if you have the time, why would you eat in the Garden? It’s not like other buildings in the middle of nowhere.

by It may HAVE to Last a Lifetime on Mar 25, 2011 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Unbelieveable??!!

This post fails to mention many things not the least of which is one tiny, little, small, miniscule point…the friggin’ ECONOMY!! Hello??!! People in the tri-state area, like the rest of America, are very much out of work, or barely hangin’ on to their jobs, esp. the true, blue Ranger fans and we’re the ones who are supposed to take pity on the Dolans, et al for “having” to raise prices to see a team either in person, or only sometimes allowed to watch on TV, that has not even reliably demonstrated it can MAKE the play-offs, let alone win a Cup…C’mon! Are you kidding me? Basically what’s been posted is that I, the loyal, diehard fan living paycheck to paycheck, am supposed to eat the cost of million dollar mistakes made by a clearly out-classed, out-dated, out-maneuvered GM who repeatedly overpays and under delivers and then gloats when he manages to “fix” his errors by “hiding” then in the minor leagues or trading them away? OMFG!…This is not how you run a business during trying times?? If anything, you offer more mini-plan reduced-price packages to the fans, or giveaways or whatever low-cost options to attract both the loyal and casual customer..not RAISE prices.

As for the cost of the renovation, are you telling me that MSG brass can’t procure money from other for-profit and non-profit organzations or corporate sponsors to cover the costs? I mean, we do all this amazing charity work on and off the ice; that’s gotta be a huge selling point to a potential sponsor or two instead of some beer manufacturer…What about Trump, for example? For those who may not have caught a recent “Apprentice” episode, The Donald clearly stated on his show that MSG was achieving the entire renovation “on its own dollar!” That was a mere days after the ticket hike was announced so what gives? (I know, the show is taped, but still..) Raising prices is a lazy, short-sighted way to get the money needed to build, maintain and draw what the building is going to need and warrant to stay current in today’s and tomorrow’s sports and economic market.

As for the Isles proximity, this is a non-issue as far as Ranger fans are concerned. I’d still think Potvin Sucks if they moved to the Czech Republic! Plus, it’s not like Uniondale is that tough to get to by LIRR, so there’s no real difference being there vs. Bklyn or Queens or anywhere accessible by mass transit. And, do we really care about the Isles or Devils or even Philly or Buffalo’s effect on us? Just look at this year and our undying devotion while the other two metro-area teams have basically wallowed in non-playoff neverland for the entire year! If anything, WE help THEM!

Anyway, I will likely continue to go to my 1 or 2 games per year at MSG and luckily – for now that is – watch them on Comcast or NBC. But if Dolan – yes, Mr. Jim Dolan – actually took a step back and really considered what was best for the team, the fans, the building and the city of NY, I’m sure he could’ve come up with other more reasonable alternatives…that’s for sure!

by mgweissman on Mar 25, 2011 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

While you look at the multi-million dollar mistakes the GM made, of which the bill is now being passed on to ticket purchasers, you should look at the billion dollar mistakes Dolan and the rest of corporate America have made, and have now placed the bill at the foot of the taxpayer. Same situation, much worse effects. And now us loyal Ranger fans have to pay both bills. I’m not too sure, but I think we got screwed over in that deal..

by broadwayblueshirts on Mar 25, 2011 6:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Excellent point and you’re right on all accounts…

by mgweissman on Mar 25, 2011 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

this post gets a big ol'

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by joereiter on Mar 25, 2011 11:59 AM EDT reply actions  

Not really

I think we’ll all still blame Dolan since he is the one raising prices and he is the one who will reap the benefits of the renovations.

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by Broheem NJ on Mar 25, 2011 1:46 PM EDT reply actions  

that's exactly why it gets the derp

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by joereiter on Mar 25, 2011 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

While we all love to lob chants of “Kansas City” at the Fishsticks faithful, we really should be chanting “Brooklyn.” The Islanders relocating closer to the center of the universe would increase the supply of hockey tickets in the immediate vicinity of the Garden, and depress demand for Rangers tickets amongst marginal fans and corporations. T

Wasnt that the same argument made in the early 80s when Rockies became the Devils? I dont know how much of a hit NYR attendance took after the Devils moved, but it hasnt seemed to hurt them long-term.

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by poploser on Mar 25, 2011 4:19 PM EDT reply actions  

Out of curiousity… how much do tickets run out of MSG (never been myself, I’m clear across the country)?

by one-bar on Mar 25, 2011 6:48 PM EDT reply actions  

I really thought I couldn’t despise Keynesian economics any more, until I saw its flawed theories used to describe my favorite hockey team. In short, a raise in demand in no way necessitates a raise in price. Without getting too deep into it, what the high demand should do is to encourage innovation as to which serve the needs of those who hold the demand but cannot have the demand fulfilled. For example, Buffalo has outdoor viewing parties for important games, and if you have ever seen the crowds, it is impressive. Now what if Buffalo charged a nominal fee for people to come watch in turn for providing a service, like comfortable seating or a weather resistant roof? If it is successful, they can sell advertising space, concessions, and more seating. Then, they could set multiple places around the city in which to do this, to accommodate people in other parts of the city, or to accommodate a growing number of people. This would have created a revenue stream that could pay for another special project, while not affecting ticket price.

Or we can go the Keynesian route and just raise the ticket price…

by broadwayblueshirts on Mar 25, 2011 6:53 PM EDT reply actions  

Wow

I think its pretty sweet that more taxpayer $$ isn’t being spent on the Garden renovation but that’s about where the kind words end. Idk if this guy is just really rich or if he works for MSG or what but this is a mind-bottling fan post.
The real fans that go into that building, night in, night out & cheer a good shift or better yet, know what actually encompasses a good shift worth getting behind CANNOT (for the most part) afford to pay $15,000+ for season tickets. I wouldn’t care if the Devils & the Whale & the Isles all were MSG co-tenants, it is an assinine point/article. Ahh-BOOOO

Were they saying "Boo" or "Boo-urns?"
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by Kendrick Jay on Mar 25, 2011 7:17 PM EDT reply actions  

You PR representatives are getting sneakier every day

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-Ahmad Bradshaw is undoubtedly a psychic genius.

by Scratch and Snif on Mar 25, 2011 7:32 PM EDT reply actions  

Dolan's the nipple head that forced that Knicks trade

and he’s moving it over to the Rangers as well. Dolan always deserves blamed cuz he’s Bilbo Baggins.

Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows

by Rorschach44 on Mar 25, 2011 8:56 PM EDT reply actions  

Why are you insulting Bilbo Baggins?

"He who gets the best players usually wins" - Bobby Bowden

by Russ on Mar 27, 2011 7:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Some good points, however...

I think some good points were brought up. Tickets are most certainly based on supply and demand, as prices are for any other good or service. It’s also true that MSG will look at competitors’ prices/amenities and will look to compete against other stadiums and arenas in the area.

While many “true fans” loathe this concept, unfortunately that is the world in which we live. Corporations need to entertain clients and there is huge market in NYC for high end suites and luxury seats…fortunately for Buffalo fans (unfortunately for their owners) their city doesn’t have to deal with that segment of attendees.

The one thing I disagree with is not pointing fingers at Dolan. Dolan is most certainly involved in the decision making process of setting ticket prices, as is Hank Ratner (Dolan’s right hand man) and Scott O’Neill, who sends those lovely emails to season subs.

The Islanders moving to Brooklyn won’t make prices lower, but it will certainly keep prices “competitive” because after all, fans will be willing to pay to see them over any team from Kansas City.

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by The Suit on Mar 25, 2011 10:58 PM EDT reply actions  

I dont really care who is to blame

The point is, I cant afford to go to games. I’m not blaming anyone, but that doesnt mean I’m not pissed about it.

by Steeeve on Mar 26, 2011 1:21 AM EDT reply actions  

This View Is Ridiculous

There is no absolving Jimmy Dolan of his greed.

T

by cmont on Mar 26, 2011 6:35 PM EDT reply actions  

i think you’re gonna need a bigger box

"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx

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by Kevin Power on Mar 27, 2011 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nah,

It might look like that due to the pic, but the box is 2ft,by 2ft, by 2ft. The slot on top is big enough for the gold bars to go through.
Seriously, since Dolan is paying for the renovations himself, I guess he has to get the money from some where. It might even had been a condition for a loan, who knows?

by nathansfamous on Mar 27, 2011 10:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

When I see that I want to put some water and a fish in it. Or maybe a bug and a twig with some leaves on it.

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by Dig Deep on Mar 28, 2011 3:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

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