Rangers Analysis: Should Glen Sather Target Filatov?
by Joe Fortunato on Jun 20, 2011 6:00 AM EDT
in New York Rangers Analysis
Email
Print
Rumors and the off-season go hand in hand, especially when you're dealing with a big market team like the New York Rangers. One of the rumors that was especially prevalent last off-season, and even into the regular season, was the New York Rangers targeting Nikita Filatov.
Filatov, the 6th overall pick of the 2009 NHL Entry Draft, has spent two lackluster seasons in Columbus and it appears like he might be on his way out. While rumors about him being on the trading block last year were all speculation, this year is a completely different story.
Aaron Portzline of The Columbus Dispatch wrote this in an article yesterday:
And then there's Nikita Filatov, who is quickly running out of time to prove his NHL worthiness. If the right offer is made - a fourth-round draft pick, a middling prospect or an aged veteran - Filatov will be sent packing.
Could it really be that simple to acquire a 21-year-old top-flight prospect? Yes, Filatov has had three unconvincing years in Columbus thus far after reportedly clashing with the Blue Jackets' brass. But he is certainly worth the risk.
Join me after the jump for more.
In his short NHL career, Filatov has played in 44 games registering six goals and seven assists for 13 points. While the numbers aren't overwhelming, Filatov is a prospect with a significant amount of upside.
He put up nearly a point-per-game in the KHL as a 20-year-old, during a loan to Moscow, and has offensive tools and talent that have other teams' scouting departments drooling. Obviously he has worn out his welcome in Columbus, maybe he just needs a change of scenery.
John Tortorella and Glen Sather have made it a priority to infuse youth into the team the past few years. What better way to do that then by swinging a deal for Filatov?
The Rangers certainly have the assets in the farm system. Under the requirements set forth by Portzline all the Rangers would need to do is ship off a mid-round pick and a decent prospect. No, Chris Drury (even if he waived his MVC and was deemed healthy before the trade) would not apply here.
But the Rangers do have players in the minors who seem to have undefined roles. Especially after the acquisition of Tim Erixon, and with guys like Dylan McIlrath waiting in the wings, there is a logjam at defense for the Rangers. Perhaps prospects like Jyri Niemi, Tomas Kundratek or Pavel Valentenko are suddenly more expendable.
If Sather could pull off a mid-round pick and one of the expendable defensive prospects listed above the move is a no brainer. Filatov represents a tremendous risk, but at the price it would cost to get him it's a move to make seven days a week and twice on Sunday. The Rangers would get another top-flight prospect from another team (on top of Ryan McDonagh and Tim Erixon) for pennies on the dollar.
Filatov would have a strong chance to make the team out of camp, and wouldn't need to be rushed to make an instant impact. The Rangers could easily lean on guys like Ryan Callahan, Brandon Dubinsky, Derek Stepan and Artem Anisimov for secondary scoring. Marian Gaborik and whomever the Rangers acquire this off-season as a number one center can handle the primary scoring, allowing Folatov to find his comfort zone and develop properly.
Anyway, a lot of this is still just speculation, but it appears that Filatov is actually on the trading block, and the Rangers should make a run at him.
Thoughts guys?
200 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Yes
Filatov has a lot of potential and a change in scenery is good for his career. If the price is right, then let’s take him. I would do Kundratek and CGY 5th for him (at best, pending desired offer).
I wonder if it is that easy to acquire Rick Nash
I think Nash is the centerpiece. They don’t have anyone else to be the face of the franchise. And when Johansen makes it up, I’m sure they’ll look to keep those two together.
I’m sure he was joking lol
by Mr. Avery to you on Jun 20, 2011 7:23 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
id do it in a heartbeat
man itd be amazing to get rick nash and filatov. god i hope sather can pull something to get them both for barely anything as he usually does
If only Drury and crappy prospects for Nash and Filatov were possible.
by danmarley21 on Jun 20, 2011 6:38 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I actually posed this question last offseason
When Filatov was pretty much in the same position with regard to his relationship with the Columbus organization.
I say do it if he’s available. Best part is, it’s clear that he’s worn out his welcome there, and the Blue Jacket’s couldn’t ask a king’s ransom without looking like fools.
I see this as Zerdev / Woliski part three. Pass
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jun 20, 2011 6:35 AM EDT reply actions
Was thinking same thing.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Jun 20, 2011 6:38 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I was thinking this too, but...
Zherdev or Wolski would still be worth the minimal price. And if he exceeds that – certainly possible given his talent – this could be a steal. There is great upside and limited downside. It is certainly worth doing.
If Filatov comes in and has the season Zherdev did as a Ranger for what adds up to middling assets I would be ecstatic.
Players like this, sure they come in score a few pretty goals maybe get you a few extra points on the board…but will not win you the cup. They are not winners they are selfish players.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jun 20, 2011 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Correct you don’t win the cup if they are your primary option, but Filatov would not be brought in to carry the offense. Please stop with the Zherdev comparisons, and grouping these guys together like they think as a hive-mind, very little is known about why Filatov did not gel with Hitchcock, and he is 2 years younger than Zherdev was when we acquired him.
If he comes and in plays like Zherdev (60 points) I’d be ecstatic.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
by Moshe52792 on Jun 20, 2011 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
One man's trash usually ends up being another man's trash
Please educate me on why Filatov won’t be Zherdev/Lisin/Wolski part IV.
Not against sending a mid round pick or someone like EC or even Gilroys rights…just want to know what Filatov has done in the three years to keep some of you so interested in his potential.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Jun 20, 2011 6:37 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
From what I researched on my way to work, it seemed that Columbus tried rushing him into becoming this elite skilled forward. he has shown that when entering his prime he is capable of reaching a point per game, but when rushing one’s development, shit happens. For a crappy pick and a low-grade prospect, we can help turn this guy around and bring out the true player that he is. Worth a shot. If anything we can put him in CT in beginning of the year since they want to revamp the Whale until he is ready.
by danmarley21 on Jun 20, 2011 6:50 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Reasons
- ranked European skater in his draft class
Under-20 Team Russia coach and two-time Stanley Cup Champion, Sergei Nemchinov
“He is a talented hockey player with a good technique and good speed, too. He definitely has an NHL upside because he can score, is a well-rounded player and is responsible in the defensive zone.”
The kid is highly skilled. You take a shot at him. If it doesn’t work you keep it moving.
Trade him to Phoenix if All else fails
by danmarley21 on Jun 20, 2011 7:10 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Hmmm, Columbus, former 1st round pick, incredible talent, underachiever, could be had...
DON’T TRADE ANY YOUNG D-MEN FOR HIM!!!
Were they saying "Boo" or "Boo-urns?"
@SlayerSantana on Twitter
why?
Last time I checked we can’t have 10 defensemen on the NHL roster… somebody is getting moved at one point or another, I don’t know who and wouldn’t even speculate who, but we have a plethora of defensemen… This kid is not Z or Lisin or Wolski, he was rushed and benched for his lack of defense as a 19/20 year old
@clalicata17
by Clalicata17 on Jun 20, 2011 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions
B-I-N-G-O
Were they saying "Boo" or "Boo-urns?"
@SlayerSantana on Twitter
by Kendrick Jay on Jun 20, 2011 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Apparently Tyutin sucks now. All I see is bad stuff about him. Plus we have better D-Man then him anyway. His contract is ridiculous also..
twitter.com/NYRangers365
by NYRangerFan718 on Jun 21, 2011 7:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Pass….didn’t his mother work as his agent for the early part of his career too? So you’ve got a talented, semi-motivated player (similar to Zherdev) who has already had a major feud with the organization who drafted him while being spurred on in this behavior by his family (sounds like a young Lindros). No thanks, for anything more than a 4th-rounder.
And while Hoggo’s quote from Sergei Nemchinov is a nice testament to Filatov’s skills while Filatov was in Russia, please remember that Ken Hitchcock had major problems with Filatov’s defensive effort as well as his personality…..I’m not a big fan of players who burn bridges with the first team they play for, particularly when their efforts are directed at being traded instead of earning more playing time.
Prole art threat.
His mother was his agent? Isn’t there a problem with Kirill Kabanov and his father controlling his strings?
yeah, I saw that yesterday…free-market Russia is just as messed-up about how things work as communist Russia was….at least talent could make its own mark in Russian hockey back in those days, instead of money.
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jun 20, 2011 9:17 AM EDT up reply actions
It sounds good, but eventually you just have to realize that while the talent is there, the thing between the ears is not.
Every top 10 pick has talent, but not every one of them turn out good and Filatov is one of them.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
yea you are
he’s had 3 seasons to crack a bottom dwelling team’s lineup. Each and every time he’s come up short. And the fact that he’s pissed off his management already? Please..you’re in perfect position to call him a bust.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
Calling a 21 year old a bust is foolish.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
No Thank You
I’d rather take my chances with the Rangers top notch scouts picking another gem in the later rounds than trying to resucitate another club’s poor draft choice (bust?).
Best Rangers day: May 27, 1994
http://media.community.blueshirtsunited.com/_Matteau-Matteau-Matteau-/audio/643191/20434.html
Worst Rangers day: April 10, 1984
by Stepan the Ice! on Jun 20, 2011 8:30 AM EDT reply actions
I would’ve advocated this move instead of Frolov last year, when there’s a clear spot for the kid and might actually get minutes. Now he’d be too far down the depth chart to make an impact, and he doesn’t seem to have the maturity level yet in his career.
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
Tracking the Rangers - Numbers don't lie. They just don't agree with you.
Twitter: RangerSmurf
never learn
when are we ever going to learn to stop taking a chances on other teams under achiivers dident we try with Woliski Zerdev and im sure theres a few more i cant recall at this time
Numbers don’t outweigh heart….Zherdev is a drunken waste of talent.
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jun 20, 2011 9:20 AM EDT up reply actions
Number don't outweigh heart?
I think I was just punched in my logic node
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
by Kevin Power on Jun 20, 2011 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Zherdev was easily the highest impact forward on the team that year, leave the speculation about his off the ice problems to yourself.
Zherdev might have been the highest impact forward during the regular season but he didn’t show up when it mattered in the playoffs. 0 points in 7 games. I can see filatov coming in and doing fine during the regular season but he just seems like another one of those players whose not going to show up when we need them to and get on Torts’ bad side very quickly. These shouldnt be the kind of players we are trying to go after anymore
by SaveByRicther on Jun 20, 2011 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah.....
And Lundqvist posted a .908 save percentage and 3.00 goals against average. Those numbers do not a winner make.
I would consider those stats “not showing up” especially for an elite player. Is Lundqvist not the kind of player the Rangers should go after, just because he had a subpar postseason?
Hooray small samples!
Here’s another, which player do we prefer
Player A) 12 playoff games, 0G 5A -2, 41SOG
Player B) 11 playoff games, 7G 7A +1 35 SOG
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
Tracking the Rangers - Numbers don't lie. They just don't agree with you.
Twitter: RangerSmurf
by George E. Ays on Jun 20, 2011 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions
I hope the sarcasm wasn’t lost on my using Lunqvist’s one postseason as an example.
Anyways, I’m going to pick Player A, because I’m sure I’ve seen you play this trick before…
Nah, I got the sarcasm. I’m emphatically making the point.
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
Tracking the Rangers - Numbers don't lie. They just don't agree with you.
Twitter: RangerSmurf
by George E. Ays on Jun 20, 2011 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions
both?
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
Close enough
Player A is 2011 Ryan Kesler – against CHI and BOS
Player B is 2011 Ryan Kesler – against NSH and SJS
This game also works well with the Sedin twins.
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
Tracking the Rangers - Numbers don't lie. They just don't agree with you.
Twitter: RangerSmurf
by George E. Ays on Jun 20, 2011 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Cheater lmao
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
woo hoo
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
player A- Callahan?
player B- Dubinsky?
just random stabs
by CrazyRangerFan on Jun 20, 2011 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions
no speculation
Check his latest folly right here. Also his drinking problem has been rumored since he was here in NYC….
There’s no speculating that a person has a drinking problem when he attacks his wife with a metal pole while drunk at a restaurant. None whatsoever.
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jun 20, 2011 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions
He hit her car, not her.
Not saying its not an effed up thing to do, but theres a HUGE difference.
You’ve never gotten angry and hit something?
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
When you learn how to quantify “heart” let me know. Until then, numbers are more significant than anything else offered.
by Hoggo on Jun 20, 2011 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
THANK YOU
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
by Kevin Power on Jun 20, 2011 12:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Rec’d
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
playing with numbers....
Darrell Powe played all 11 games in the playoffs for Philly this year, Zherdev played 8. Is Powe a better player than Zherdev? Powe had 7 goals in 81 games, while Zherdev had 16 in a mere 56 games. Zherdev was scratched in the playoffs—why? Zherdev’s numbers were better, his skills are far more prolific, and according to the numbers crowd on this website that certifies Zherdev as the better player. Why then did Laviolette—a former Stanley Cup winning coach—scratch Zherdev and not sit Powe then? Especially in the middle of a sweep?
Zherdev’s overall regular season numbers were better than Powe’s, as were his playoff numbers. Why then did Laviolette scratch Zherdev?
Zherdev was despised by his coach. Why?
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jun 20, 2011 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions
That’s like saying well as far as champagne goes this has a shitty aftertaste but hey this fermented puddle excrement aint so bad when you consider its shit, lets drink some shit.
Lemme tell you Zherdev why was scratched and Powe wasn’t. They had ENTIRELY different roles on the Flyers. Zherdev is a scorer which means he had to compete for a roster spot with Carter, Giroux, Richards, Hartnell, Leino, Briere and JVR. So what you will about the character of those guys but their skill is undeniable. Who was Powe competing against for ice time? Guys like Jody Shelley and Blair Betts. You cannot compare Zherdev and Powe more than you can compare Zherdev and Bradon Coburn.
by Zuppa Di Pesce on Jun 21, 2011 12:21 AM EDT up reply actions
Different roles, yes—Powe understood his on the Flyers, and played hard and responsibly; Zherdev did not. I used Powe as an example because Zherdev is so much more talented than Powe, yet somehow Powe won his coach’s trust while Zherdev did not.
I’m done with this discussion. If two different Cup-winning NHL coaches don’t like the guy and don’t play him, that speaks volumes about the gap between Zherdev’s talent and his desire to be a successful NHL player; to me it’s more convincing than any of the arguments offered here in Zherdev’s defense. If people want to call a guy who sat in the pressbox during a playoff run an impact player worthy of the Rangers’ time and attention, I ain’t going to stop them.
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jun 21, 2011 6:42 AM EDT up reply actions
They had entirely separate roles. The Flyers had enough skill, and needed more grit for the 3rd and 4th line, hence Powe over Zherdev.
Just like the Rangers sometimes played Avery over MZA, if they needed more grit than skill.
Comparing those two players means nothing.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
+1
Someone said a smart thing.
@DigDeepNYR
"I like a man who grins when he fights." -Sir Winston Churchill
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
C’mon guys – just looking at numbers has doomed the Rangers in the past. Torts and Sather have just started to put together a team with character and identity, bringing Zherdev back, or adding Filatov, don’t add to that, they detract. They are unwanted by their organizations – that’s fact. Do we know why? No. But its a problem that is just as valuable as looking at numbers.
Personally, I want the Rangers to continue building a team with character and solid identity.
I tend to agree, but at the same time if the price is a mid-level prospect or a mid-round pick for Filatov, you have to do it. He has way to much upside.
It would be stupid not to take a chance on him. He’s 21.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
how is he not worth taking a chance?
how often is a non under achiever available for a trade? we got wolski on a rental and moved a huge dead weight contract in the process. thats a no brainer and everyone here loved it when we tried it. and remember this comment when wolski is near the team lead in goals next year (excluding gabbo). hes in a contract year so it will motivate him but thats besides the point. my point is that when a player who a team drafted is not underachieveing hes not gonna be available for a trade anyway. just doesnt make sense. but if the rangers think they could squeeze some more juice out of this KID, yes hes still a kid at 21, then its a no brainer. especially on a team like ours that wont be expecting anything out of him. let him come in and play a few minutes on the power play maybe or even send him to hartford. some new scenery and new coaching might give him a boost. crazier things have happened and really from what they seem to want in return it cant possibly not be worth the risk imo.
Kendrick Jay..
I was thinking the same thing. Gee, Where have I heard this before. A talented young Russian from Columbus. But, I really like this kid, I think he’s a bit cocky which is hendering his ice time.
I’d like to see him pull that shit on Torts. Maybe he even starts to mesh with Step and man that could be quite a formidable duo. Maybe Thomas on left or right with them.
Although I am against the idea of trading anything worthwhile for him, I would love to see him get a shot here and flourish under our system. Sather again would look like a genius we could always get something back for hem at the deadline if it didn’t work out.
I say,,, Do it..
5th rd pick & Gilroy's rights, ok. Hahaha
Were they saying "Boo" or "Boo-urns?"
@SlayerSantana on Twitter
by Kendrick Jay on Jun 20, 2011 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Ehh
Sounds great on paper. But having seen the kid play a few times, he’s pretty invisible. All the hype seemed to be blown out of proportion. He may have some skill, but if he was truly anything special, we would have at least seen glimpses of it by now.
Pierre McGuire needs to go away.
by MartyEqualsPansy on Jun 20, 2011 9:26 AM EDT reply actions
I can Name that Tune
in NO notes…..
- CLB prospect in 2005: #1 Prospect 2005
- CLB prospect in 2011: Scroll down a bit after clicking for #2 Prospect
So, let’s see…….
didn’t get along with Hitchock – check.
had one or more changes of scenery already with minimal change, if any – check
Still hasn’t lived up to expectations – check
Still has unreasonable expectations of his own value – check.
Which of these two CLB prospects am I describing above?
Answer: Yes.
Came here to post the exact same thing, this coming from a (former) huge fan of Zherdev.
Check out my pic a day for a year project-
Life Through My Lens
For the price
getting a guy with his upside would be worth it. Say what you will about Torts and his attitude with guys like FIaltov, Tortorella knows how to get the best out of a player. Both Lacavalier and Richards said they wouldn’t be half the players they are if it weren’t for Torts.
I don’t see the issue of giving it a shot. So long as the price is right
Blueshirt Banter: Covering the New York Rangers the only NHL team with three home arenas.
"We can trade Lisin for a gun, then hold it to Drury’s head and make him waive the no-movement clause" - XLII
"Tortorelli sounds like a kind of pasta… an unforgiving, stubborn, chewy, flavorless pasta that demands ‘jam’ from other pastas." - Dig Deep
by Joe Fortunato on Jun 20, 2011 11:58 AM EDT up reply actions
If the price is nothing more than a 4th round pick – I won’t be upset.
There have never been 2 players, both of the same nationality, both HIGH 1st round draft picks, both by the same club, that have had the same word used repeatedly about their personality and play – until recently.
“Enigma”
Given the track record with “projects” (Hmmmm…..Zherdev, Lisin, etc.) I don’t see the value. I’d rather the coaching staff (even in HFD) spend time with those truly committed by virtue of their actions. This guy has not shown it.
I don't want any part of this guy either
talented sure, but we’ve had too many guys like this.
"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"
I think it’s way to early to write-off Filatov… He got the short end of the stick in columbus, Hitchcock’s system was so scutinizing of any player in the lineup who was weak defensively, also Hitchcock benched him repeatedly gave him hardly any minutes and that pushed him out the door… Honestly, thats now how you treat a prospect whom is 19/20 years old… Hitchcock ended up being fired and by that time he’d already burned all the bridges with filatov and the CBJ…
He’s not Zherdev and he’s not Lisin… He needs a system where he can be allowed to get creative… If i’m not mistaken Zherdev had a great year up until Renney was fired and his ice-time was stripped… Lisin did not get a fair shake either, not saying he’s a great player, but he is no where near filatov’s skill, Zherdev maybe, but Zherdev was known more for his puck skills and he was known raw talent, guy was magic with the puck…
we were talking extensions with Z before Torts came over… I like Torts as a coach, but I think his system is far to restrictive for guys like Z or Filatov, you have to let them go…
@clalicata17
Ever heard of buy low, everyone?
While I don’t discount the doubts when it comes to Filatov (defensive zone issues, intensity questions, “softness” factor), this is a clear low-risk, buy-low situation. He makes under a million, and can probably be had for less than a fourth. To cast off any player at 21 is naive to say the least.
I wouldn’t be opposed to at least kicking the tires with CLB to find out how eager they are to rid of him.
Blueshirt Banter - Muddling in Mediocrity - Fantasy Hockey Scouts
US Soccer/Red Sox Supporter
Yo Rob L, what's up with Jozy's hammy?
Hahahaha, off topic + 1,000,000,000
Were they saying "Boo" or "Boo-urns?"
@SlayerSantana on Twitter
by Kendrick Jay on Jun 20, 2011 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Depends on Filatov's Cost
If we could acquire Filatov for a prospect who is not going to figure in the Rangers’ future plans, I would do it. He’s very young and talented. With proper coaching and mentoring, he might turn into something good. It’s worth the risk if he doesn’t cost us much. We have too many grinders. We need skill players who might turn into snipers. Torts needs to develop at least 2 skill lines and let them play a skilled, non-grinding game. Enough of the dump and chase. It is not the right style of play for Gaborik, Wolski, MZA or Anisimov (or Brad Richards if we are lucky enough to get him). Skilled players who can move the puck, pass to open teammates and score are in short supply on the Rangers roster. Brandon Prust is a great grinder, but Torts seems to want everybody to play just like him.
If we had a specific spot on the second line for him
I would definitely do it we have high end defensive prospects in the system to burn as trade bait to improve our offense. Yes this kid is a bit immature but aren’t we all at 21 and 22. Getting him for cheap and putting him on a team with guys like Dubinsky, Callahan, Stepan and Staal would help him mature and learn how to be a team player while using hims crazy offensive skills to help the team
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
Wolski, it’s not really close either.
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
Tracking the Rangers - Numbers don't lie. They just don't agree with you.
Twitter: RangerSmurf
by George E. Ays on Jun 20, 2011 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd take Wolski
more established player
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
by Kevin Power on Jun 20, 2011 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Wolski for sure
"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"
by feslenraster on Jun 20, 2011 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Acquiring him might help us get Wolski off the cap
Absolute Worst Ranger Fan!!!!!!....yet incredibly realistic and usually correct.
sure, but
it will leave the team with yet another uncertainty, even more than W.W.
"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"
by feslenraster on Jun 20, 2011 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Not sure I agree with that at all.
Zherdev might come here on the cheap but that experiment didn’t have a happy ending for the Rangers. He didn’t really gel well with Torts and the system the Rangers were putting in place back then that we have slowly turned into the way we (try) to play the game.
@DigDeepNYR
"I like a man who grins when he fights." -Sir Winston Churchill
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
I was being sarcastic lol, I used to like Zherdev when he was a Ranger but thats then. I was using him as a comparison to how I really would not like to acquire Filatov as he is even more of a head case than Zherdev and will frustrate this fan base and organization far more than Z ever did.
by CrazyRangerFan on Jun 20, 2011 7:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd do it for a conditional draft pick
How about Fitatov for a 4th rd conditional pick and if he scores 20 goals next year it becomes a 3rd rd pick?
I would not give up a prospect + draft pick for him though.
agreed just either or , not both
"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"
by feslenraster on Jun 20, 2011 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Zherdev experiment?
Really, I am confident that many of you who think Z was a waste don’t know his stats when he was here…….let me refresh you……82 games played, 23 goals, 35 assists, 58pts, +6, 39PIM. Those are pretty solid numbers for this team and imagine we had a guy doing that last year on top of the regular players? In 52 games with the failers he was on par to at least match those stats. He is a good second tier player. If he is a dick, so what. We want our team to win. you don’t think the players deal with it among themselves if someone is a complete asshole? They tolerate Aves so I’m sure a russina kid won’t be an issue.
You can say Lisin was an experiment. I’d like to get Filitov and develop him in our system in a heart beat. I think its a no brainer Maybe the problems are not these young kids……maybe Torts has something to do with it. Maybe he hates Russia and communism?
Absolute Worst Ranger Fan!!!!!!....yet incredibly realistic and usually correct.
Name that player:
56 GP 16G 6A +5 22 PIM
Available for all 82 games (if memory serves). Surrounded by talent on a top 4 team in the conference. Healthy scratch for long stretches because of reported “lack of effort”, “lackadasical play”, etc. etc.
If that’s a good 2nd line player, I think I’ll keep Dubinsky and Callahan on the 2nd line.
It’s Zherdev who was like 3rd in the league in goals/60 minutes played. Talk to any Flyers fan and they will tell you he was unjustly treated and no more of a defensive liability than Leino or Briere.
Very good.
Many Flyers fans don’t agree with that “unjust” statement.
Try this one, except ID the team and coach:
Nikolay Zherdev hadn’t been in the ’s lineup largely because he wasn’t playing with the same kind of effort and intensity that coach expected.
Choices: Blue Jackets/Hitchcock
Rangers/Renney
Rangers/Tortorella
Flyers/Laviolette
Here’s a portion from an email I exchanged with a friend who’s a Philly fan:
Look at Zherdev, he’s your typical skilled former Soviet player, but the Flyers make him a healthy scratch because they don’t trust non-North Americans. I swear to God, Bobby Clarke has actually come out and admit he still hates Russians, which is great news when they produce so many stars.
There were a lot of fans who felt the same. I doubt that bias is more prevalent in the league than is admitted.
I see a lot of people using “fan opinion” as evidence for something – who cares? There must be reasons coaches like Torts and Laviolette don’t trust/play them. I’ll take their opinions over the average Flyers fan any day. Is it just blind hatred or ethno-centricity? Maybe… but if they want to win, why would they do that? There’s something wrong with these players that the fans don’t have the opportunity to see. They are big enough warning signs to stay away.
Wasn’t using it as evidence for or against Zherdev… just providing an example of what a Flyers fan says, straight from the source, as a response to the King’s post above
Talk to any Flyers fan and they will tell you he was unjustly treated and no more of a defensive liability than Leino or Briere.
Their opinions are as valid or invalid as the opinions that we all share here. My opinion is that there are coaches in the league that do not like the European style of play, which is often considered softer. This seems to be why so many “highly skilled” players are seen as “not tough” or whatever.
There is a correlation
Agreed with that. And some teams love that style as well.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
The numbers he put up as a Failer, in 56 games are comparable to what our 2nd line guys did. They are not far off. I’m not making a case for bringing him back……I am saying when he was here he was like the 2nd leading scorer on the team and hardly an experiment. If Filatov could put up the 23 goals in a season here that Z did, he would be worth it and very cheap alternative in secondary scoring.
Absolute Worst Ranger Fan!!!!!!....yet incredibly realistic and usually correct.
just having the numbers isn’t enough… look at the Canucks, look at the Caps. These players are lacking some important qualities – it takes intangibles to win as well… hard work, consistent effort, responsible d-zone play, character… Zherdev doesn’t have it.
The Canucks won 15 out of the necessary 16 playoff games this year. I’m not thinking intangibles is what killed them.
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
Tracking the Rangers - Numbers don't lie. They just don't agree with you.
Twitter: RangerSmurf
by George E. Ays on Jun 20, 2011 9:06 PM EDT up reply actions
basically the Sedins and Kesler didn’t show up the finals is what did.
by CrazyRangerFan on Jun 20, 2011 9:12 PM EDT up reply actions
everything else was in place for that team, except for Lu as well.
by CrazyRangerFan on Jun 20, 2011 9:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly. They were pretty easily the best team in the league for about 95 games. They didn’t just forget how to win in the Finals. They got beat.
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
Tracking the Rangers - Numbers don't lie. They just don't agree with you.
Twitter: RangerSmurf
by George E. Ays on Jun 20, 2011 9:17 PM EDT up reply actions
yea, they got beat by a team with a clear identity, strong character, work ethic and chemistry. Not by a bunch of Zherdev’s.
That, and a goalie that put up one of the three-four best seasons in the history of the NHL.
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
Tracking the Rangers - Numbers don't lie. They just don't agree with you.
Twitter: RangerSmurf
by George E. Ays on Jun 20, 2011 9:21 PM EDT up reply actions
comparing the character of the opposing goalies may be a good place to start when comparing the teams in general.
You mean the goalie that just won an Olympic gold medal, is a former team captain (a rarity for a goalie), is a finalist for the Vezina, and tended goal on his team’s road to the 7th game of the Stanley Cup finals?
Yeah, he may seem to be spoiled, but let’s not question the man’s character.
what does credibility have to do with this? And what do the achievements Hoggo mentioned above have to do with character? And where did I say anything definitive about Luongo’s character?
The fact is, he has been questioned at every stage of his career, and will continue to be.
I don’t want to make this about Luongo – the fact remains, numbers aren’t everything.
Agreed. Maybe he’s a dick, maybe not, but he’s still a great goalie.
Regardless though, Tim Thomas was better, and probably the reason Boston won.
Also, Kesler and the Sedins no-showed.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Agreed completely.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
no, its not – but they put up a ton of points in the regular season, and that wasn’t enough. My point, which still stands, is that Zherdev’s numbers for that one season alone, are not enough to need him on this team.
This argument, “people forget how many points Z put up for us”, is silly. It has no bearing on whether or not he’s a good fit for this current team. He’s not. If he has no place on a contender, he’s not gonna put us over the top.
Again we are talking Filatov...not Z
Z is only in this convo because people are comparing the two. As if they know whats going on behind the scene or in the guys head. Low risk, possibly high return on Filitov
Absolute Worst Ranger Fan!!!!!!....yet incredibly realistic and usually correct.
I get that…. but I’m not saying “don’t bring in Filatov because he’s like Z”. I’m just pointing out that saying, “People forget how good Z was”, is not a valid argument for bringing in Filatov.
Yup, just like people saying Zherdev was a headcase is not a valid argument for not bringing in Filatov.
They are different people.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
+87654367876323456765433456765
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
So…do you agree with him…or?
Follow me on twitter @nyybrandonc
Writer for Pinstripe Alley
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
If you don't love David Robertson and Brett Gardner I don't love you.
Kinda.. I’m a little split.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Take him.
If all it will cost is a mid-round pick and lower level prospect you have to make this move. He’s a top ten pick, and regardless of what he’s done in the previous 3 years he has obvious talent and could end up being a solid top 6 player. Even if he doesn’t pan out, you lose a 4th rounder and prospect that might not end up cracking the lineup anyways… Big risk, big reward.
Is it me, or does Filatov seem like a slightly better, Russian, Chris Kreider?
Both of the them were top ranked draft picks as skaters, both had one exceptional WJC tourney (in their first year – Filatov’s tourney was actually better). Kreider’s NCAA seasons match up pretty closely to Filatov’s AHL numbers.
The point here is that people are comparing him to a player they assume was lazy in Zherdev. The fact is, a late rd pick and or a prospect that likely will never make the Rangers for this guy is a no brainer. He definately has the skill. The cost won’t be big….give it a shot. If it doesn’t work out, well most people expected that, if it does……..you have a diamond in the rough.
Absolute Worst Ranger Fan!!!!!!....yet incredibly realistic and usually correct.
No
Dont take him he cant even break the lineup in columbus, he hasnt had great numbers so far he has been disappointing dont even waste cap on him
for a late 2012 draft pick... yes
Its all about the asking price with me.
Filatov’s potential is through the roof, so its worth a late pick, just not this draft, as we have so few picks to begin with.
by MyMarriageIsVeryMessier on Jun 20, 2011 4:34 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
With his potential, he’s easily worth a late round pick. I would even throw a mid-level prospect in there.
For all the comparisons to Zherdev, I am confused as to why people don’t want him here. How many games last year did we say “This team shows so much heart but just isn’t skilled enough to score”
People say that, but than refuse to bring in a guy like Filatov. If you forgot already, Zherdev put up 58 points on the Rangers. If Filatov = Zherdev like many of you say, those 58 points would be gladly welcomed by me, as a Rangers fan.
Acquiring him is a no-brainer of the asking price is that low.
And enough of the generalizations of character and enough of grouping every Russian player into one category. It makes you sound uneducated and racist.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
In my opinion people are cautious about a player like Filatov because the comparison to Zherdev is just too damn easy. A young Russian, skilled, sniper from Columbus? And unfortunately people tend to forget what you brought up… that Zherdev may have been inconsistent but he did put up some numbers and stepped up his game (on occasion) when the chips were down and we needed someone to step up.
I agree that people are prejudiced to Russian players… but it is not racism. Russians aren’t a “race”. They are xenophobic and small-minded. Goes back to the whole thing where Russian players are lazy and only care about making a pretty play… that they don’t play defense, that they are flaky, and are only in the game for the money. It is uneducated and inappropriate. Find me a harder working player than Pavel Datsyuk, it can’t be done.
If the asking price is low for Filatov it is worth rolling the dice. It is difficult to find top-shelf talent, our team needs some raw talent.
@DigDeepNYR
"I like a man who grins when he fights." -Sir Winston Churchill
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
“They are xenophobic and small-minded” was not referring to Russian-players obviously, but I thought I would make it clear. I was referring to those people who generalize all Russian players as being lazy and heartless.
@DigDeepNYR
"I like a man who grins when he fights." -Sir Winston Churchill
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
not one person in this thread has said that all Russian players are like that. For me at least, this has nothing to do with ethnicity. This has to do with the fact that there are some extremely clear character issues with these players. Ranger teams in the ‘dark ages’ often lacked character. We’re starting to build with character and talent… let’s continue that.
Goes back to the whole thing where Russian players are lazy…
You’ll notice that I never say anyone said that in this particular thread, but it has been said before here on the Banter and it will certainly be said again.
My comment was a “reply” to what Moshe said, it was intended for him.
@DigDeepNYR
"I like a man who grins when he fights." -Sir Winston Churchill
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Not in this threat, but it has been said on this site multiple times, and on any other hockey site I’m sure. Lots of people do make that generalization unfortunately.
Regardless, I agree that a team needs character, something we have and are continuing to develop. But we need some skill too, and if the price to acquire a 21 year old first round pick we boatloads of raw talent is only a 4th round draft pick, it should be a no-brainer. Too many games last year we were down by a goal and couldn’t score cause all we could do was grind.
It’s essentially a no-risk move.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Fair enough. And it wasn’t a post aimed at everyone here, or anyone in particular. Just a general statement about some of the comments I’ve seen, and about how some people truly feel.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
It certainly is not racism but I brought up a very similar point about hockey fans in general and their propensity to label Russians as heartless, defensively indifferent, mercenaries on BB about 6 months ago and got chastised for it.
a question
I’ve got Valeri Kharlamov as my icon….I have Ukrainian relatives….and I love Russian history and literature. Is it OK for me to call Zherdev heartless? I came to that conclusion after watching him play the 2008-09 season with the Rangers.
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jun 20, 2011 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Here he is showing none of this “heart” I have been hearing so much about:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Abo8hnXz8I4&NR=1
he cared so little about that goal he nearly fell over with all his teammates celebrating it.
How about this one..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWK4SLwWM-o
No heart.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
I think the wall you are running into with that comment is the following: There is no greater insult to a hockey player than being called “heartless” in my opinion. Hockey requires heart, it takes a lot of heart to go out there with 100mph slap shots being shot in your direction and 6’4" 250 lb. freight trains skating around trying to kill you.
The wall you are running into is that you are claiming Zherdev has no heart. I think his issue is that he was never successfully coached and has a lack of focus. Is he lacking the heart department? I am not going to say he isn’t… but it is hard to say that the guy doesn’t care. He clearly loves the game and loves to play it, but he appears to be troubled off the ice and at times, on it. You can’t quantify “heart”.
Whatever your definition of heart may or may not be (motivation, courage, drive, determination, willpower, etc.) may be it is a pretty heavy thing to say someone has no heart.
@DigDeepNYR
"I like a man who grins when he fights." -Sir Winston Churchill
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
all true, but...
At the level of the NHL obviously any player must possess sick skills and have some sort of ambition motivating him; I’m not disputing that. But when a guy who can handle the puck like Zherdev spends the last 30+ games of his Ranger career running away from the puck or not driving to the net then obviously something is wrong. Nobody will confuse Zherdev with Brian Leetch in terms of on-ice effort; nobody will mistake him for Datsyuk in terms of desire for victory—and what makes them different from Zherdev is their individual character, in my opinion.
Devotion to statistics can lead to the idea that all human effort is quantifiable. Nothing is completely transparent about a human being, whether they are an accountant, an athlete, or a sportswriter. Zherdev has massive skills, but he cannot apply them on a regular basis. Talent doesn’t suddenly desert a player in his twenties; it is there all the time, waiting to be engaged. What makes a player separate himself from the rest of the league is to have the drive to be great all the time. And that is not something that can be quantified at all, really. It’s either there or it’s lacking…and in Zherdev’s case I believe his talent is undermined by his character rather than enhanced. Maybe heartless is too weak a word, or maybe it’s the wrong word…
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jun 20, 2011 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s either there or it’s lacking…and in Zherdev’s case I believe his talent is undermined by his character rather than enhanced.
I would agree. I think he has heart, but plenty of negative personality traits and character flaws that get in the way and compromise his drive and motivation as an athlete. No matter how talented you are I am not convinced you get to the NHL on skill alone, you need the drive and motivation to commit your body and mind to playing professional hockey. Some guys are much better at that than others.
Just thinking out loud with these comments, not really putting the filter on them that I normally do (before anyone jumps all over me).
@DigDeepNYR
"I like a man who grins when he fights." -Sir Winston Churchill
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Digger, who's starting at striker Wednesday night?
Off topic +1,000,000,001
Were they saying "Boo" or "Boo-urns?"
@SlayerSantana on Twitter
by Kendrick Jay on Jun 20, 2011 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions
I think its not the stereotype but rather the three years of incredibly high expectations for this kid and so far he has failed miserably on the ice as well as off ice relations with the organization. Personally I want no part in this kid as he hasn’t shown me anything to get excited about, no one time crazy highlight no physical proof of his incredible skill. Personally I just think all the potential he has is way overhyped. I want no part of Filatov.
by CrazyRangerFan on Jun 20, 2011 7:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks, just wanted to make sure I wasn’t being lumped in as a stereotyper. Since my point above about Zherdev’s drinking fired you up I didn’t want you to think I was being ignorant. I just cannot stand Nik Zherdev, I’ve admitted it before on this website.
Prole art threat.
Crap, meant this to be a reply to you, King Henrik.
Prole art threat.
by greifi griffie on Jun 20, 2011 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Still not hearing anything tangible about what Filatov brings to the table.
Put the Zherdev comparison aside and stop fantasizing about a central scouting report written several years ago, what has Filatov done at the AHL or NHL level to show even a glimpse of hope that a change of scenery would turn him around.
If anyone has anything… Would love to know. I’m not against floating a late pick or 2nd tier prospect, but other than his name and draft pedigree, what exactly are we suppose to be getting excited about?
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Jun 20, 2011 6:27 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
what has Filatov done at the AHL or NHL level to show even a glimpse of hope that a change of scenery would turn him around.
Nothing.
9G 11A 20Pts 20 PIM in 36 games in the AHL after being sent down.
Those look like Chad Kolarik numbers?
Why aren’t we getting moist about him?
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Jun 20, 2011 6:59 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
He hasn’t done much at the NHL level. I would argue that his being shuffled around the NHL lineup directly affected his numbers in Columbus.
His AHL numbers seem more than decent to me
2008-2009 Syracuse Crunch-AHL 39 16 16 32
In addition, he was almost a point per game when loaned to the KHL
2009-2010 CSKA Moscow-Rus-KHL 26 9 13 22
That doesn’t seem to bad to me, especially for a player that everyone knows has skill.
People said the same shit about Grabner, and look at him.
I don't understand this...
If you like those stats as an indicator of potential, why not give Grachev and Christian Thomas every chance to make the team. Grachev has show more two way potential in AHL than Filatov.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Jun 20, 2011 8:17 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 2 recs
I never said that Grachev or Christian Thomas shouldn’t be given a chance to make the team. In fact, I never said it so much that neither of them are mentioned at all in this thread.
The numbers were in response to:
what has Filatov done at the AHL or NHL level to show even a glimpse of hope that a change of scenery would turn him around
Those were examples of
1) Filatov not being in Columbus
2) Being productive
3) Playing against other professionals.
I de- Rec your comment, sir.
But doesn’t getting Filatov more or less ensure that they don’t make the team due to limited roster space?
These are players we know, the organizations knows and drafted. They are not another teams garbage. If he has all that talent and all that potential and is really available for that low price, well I think that speaks for itself.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jun 21, 2011 7:04 AM EDT up reply actions
But doesn’t getting Filatov more or less ensure that they don’t make the team due to limited roster space?
No, it creates more competition for said spot. If Thomas or EG outplayed him, you can bet they’re making the roster ahead of Filatov.
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
Tracking the Rangers - Numbers don't lie. They just don't agree with you.
Twitter: RangerSmurf
by George E. Ays on Jun 21, 2011 9:04 AM EDT up reply actions
Exactly. Especially with Torts as coach. Bringing in him can’t hurt. If he plays well and makes the team, well than good. If not, well than we only lost a 4th round pick and he created some competition.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
I disagree. Yeah its easy to say that but when you fact in waivers and such you might be surprised who stays.
They outplay him and then he would have to pass though waivers. Wow, even for a mid level draft pick that’s a pretty quick waste of one since I’m sure others would bite on him for free.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jun 22, 2011 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t believe Filatov’s waiver eligible yet. He doesn’t have the years or games yet.
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
Tracking the Rangers - Numbers don't lie. They just don't agree with you.
Twitter: RangerSmurf
by George E. Ays on Jun 22, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
i think you are right, waivers always confuse me. Think he has 1 or 2 seasons left.
Still don’t like. This team does not need perimeter players. Yeah it might help us win a few games here or there but that is not the goal. The Cup is and we wont get past Boston, Philly, etc with perimeter players afraid of contact.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jun 22, 2011 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree with that, but we should still acquire Filatov if the price is only a 4th round pick.
There’s nothing wrong with having multiple skilled young forwards.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
yes
they should make a trade for him if its peanuts we are giving up
Bruce Carter+Sean Lee=BRUCE LEE!!!!
by Archie Barberio on Jun 20, 2011 7:05 PM EDT reply actions
If Zherdev is "Lazy and Heartless", what does that say about all the guys with heart and work ethic's skill level
With a guy like Z, you’ve gotta take the good with the bad, we’ve got enough “scrappers” , “hustlers” and “backcheckers” that we NEED to get some skill guys and turn them loose. Torts needs to get off high horse too. Insisting that every skill guy has “jam” has worked out exactly ONE SEASON in his entire coaching career. All the others, it’s pretty much led to his teams crashing and burning.
Forgot to add there are only one guy on this team who has put up as many points as Z in a single season as a Ranger.
by BuckarooClub on Jun 20, 2011 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions
That stat means absolutely nothing
If he was on the Rangers and another teams GM could pick any forward off the Rangers roster, Z would be the 8th guy they got to.. Gaborik, Dubinsky, Callahan, Stepan, Anisimov, Boyle, Prust would all go first… think about that.
Z is less of a player than the sum of his stats represent. The majority of GMs in the league have weighed in on this and his current team has as well. Time to move on.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Jun 20, 2011 8:13 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I’m calling Prospal a goner. You need knees to play hockey.
by BuckarooClub on Jun 21, 2011 7:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Well, Zherdev’s stats for the Rangers season would have put him near the top for points on this years Bruins… but he never would have fit in to that team’s character and identity. Its not good enough to just go after a guy because of point totals (except in maybe rare cases) – chemistry, fit on a team, character, are all important to building a contender.
by j-red on Jun 20, 2011 9:13 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
There should be a great "fit on team" for Z or a player like him
The Bruins were 5th in goals for, the Rangers were 16th. Because there’s a history with Z, aI’m not saying it has to be him, but this team NEEDS guys that offense comes easy too. If we have to sacrifice some defense from that type of player, that’s not a big deal. Most of our top players are more comfortable backchecking anyway, we’re got “the best young defense in the league” and at the end of play, Hank is going to spend 60 mins a night bailing everyone out anyway.
by BuckarooClub on Jun 21, 2011 7:31 AM EDT up reply actions
I agree somewhat. I like Torts style for some of his players, but for guys like Gaborik, or Richards/Filatov if we bring them in, he needs to allow them to play their game. Vancouver let’s there 3rd/4th lines grind AND lets the Sedins, etc. play their skilled game.
I agree that this team needs some skill. I love the heart and the character, but at the same time sometimes pure skill is needed. Add to that that he only costs a 4th round pick, and this move is a no-brainer.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Exactly!!!!
I like Torts style for some of his players, but for guys like Gaborik, or Richards/Filatov if we bring them in, he needs to allow them to play their game.
I think that system also affected Wolski, Zuccarello, and Christensen (and yes, I am aware of his historic inconsistent production, but that grinding system was nowhere near his wheelhouse).
Getting the team to buy into that system was great. But if the coach believes that the majority of the players lack the talent to play a skilled game, and that trying to do so would be a failure, then isn’t the converse an equally futile endeavor? Having a skilled player play down, and not use the skills that made him a successful player is an equal failure.
Tortorella did not put Gaborik in a position to be successful this past season. I would look at him and sometimes he’d seem lost, like he’d think to himself, “well, I usually do this, but the coach will get pissed if I don’t do things his way.”
This is just stupid.. I see comments saying “If he can do what Zherdev did in his season with us”.. If you want that then go sign Zherdev. He’d most likely come back and cheap since I don’t think many teams want him (I know he has some issues right now but it’s worth a shot. We could use those 25 goals and 50+ points). Also Zherdev had a couple of really good seasons before he came to the Rangers which Filatov hsn’t. Luckily we have Sather and he won’t mess this up. Maybe a 5th round pick (Do we have a 4th? I don’t remember) for him but that’s it.
twitter.com/NYRangers365
by NYRangerFan718 on Jun 20, 2011 10:44 PM EDT reply actions
Its no more stupid than some comparing Zherdev as a headcase to Filatov
like it has any relevence. I’ve seen comments about Zherdev beating his wife….he didn’t, Zherdev’s lack of defense, and Zherdev’s laziness………some people think this thread is about bringing Zherdev back and it isn’t. Someone even said that if people expect Filatov to do what Z did when he was here, why not bring Z back instead……salary might be one answer or Tort’s would put a hit out on him , the other.
Absolute Worst Ranger Fan!!!!!!....yet incredibly realistic and usually correct.
A telling commentary.....
We all tend to go get the “easy reads” when looking for reasons to back up taking a stab at Filatov. We dig up old narratives from his draft year profile – or Hockey’s Future comments as the years go on. The problem is that they’re snapshots, and are rarely up-to-date – they’re just not a picture of the current player.
I had read the thread linked below, and had forgotten about it – but it was part of the reason why I have no interest in going after him. So, I went on a wild goose chase to try and find it. After a fair bit of work, I was rewarded.
If you think you’re getting a dynamic goal-scoring sniper – well – you probably aren’t – unless someone does a brain transplant.
by dbmaven on Jun 21, 2011 8:29 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I actually wasn’t discouraged by the article. By the way they describe what was expected of players in the Columbus system, it would seem like he’d run into the same problem with Tortorella.
Which I think is ridiculous…. let players play their game. Teach defense and responsibility, but putting players in unfamiliar, uncomfortable roles doesn’t help the team. In my opinion, for what it’s worth.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Blueshirt Banter
Related FanShots on Blueshirt Banter
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recent FanPosts
Rangers Schedule
Next 5 Games
New Jersey
|
Sun 05/27 | TBA |
Last 5 Games
|
@
New Jersey
|
Fri 05/25 | OT - L 2 - 3 |
|
New Jersey
|
Wed 05/23 | L 3 - 5 |
|
@
New Jersey
|
Mon 05/21 | L 1 - 4 |
|
@
New Jersey
|
Sat 05/19 | W 3 - 0 |
|
New Jersey
|
Wed 05/16 | L 2 - 3 |
SBNation.com Recent Stories
In Association With
Latest Puck Daddy - NHL from Yahoo! Sports
- Eulogy: Remembering the 2011-12 New York Rangers
- Stanley Cup Final: 5 keys for New Jersey Devils and Los Angeles Kings
- Friday’s Three Stars: Devils head to Final; Brodeur, Kovalchuk the difference in Game 6
- Devils eliminate Rangers in Game 6, ending fear of the past, setting course for the future
- Adam Henrique sends New Jersey Devils to Stanley Cup Final with OT goal vs. Rangers (VIDEO)
Latest stories and headlines from NHL.com
- Former Oilers Stoll, Greene grateful for 2nd chance when well-rested LA Kings face New Jersey
- Shinnimin named CHL's Player of the Year
- Capitals send left-wing Bourque to Bruins for centre Hamill
- Rangers look to get past hurt of loss to Devils
- Top-seeded Rangers have reasons for optimism after disappointing loss to Devils in East finals
