Christian Thomas and The Impact of The World Junior Championships
by Kevin Power on Aug 10, 2011 10:00 AM EDT
in New York Rangers Analysis
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August is never really a great month for big NHL news, its the dog days of summer and trying to find good news or analysis is like trying to find water in the Sahara Desert. But what is going on right now are the prospect camps for both USA Hockey and Hockey Canada's WJC teams.
We all know about JT Miller being named to the try out roster for Team USA, but Christian Thomas was invited to the Hockey Canada WJC camp and according to reports has looked impressive in the Red vs White scrimmages. Thomas is competing against the likes of Ryan Nugent-Hopkins, Jonathan Huberdeau and Sean Couterier for roster spots on next year's World Junior Championships team.
If Christian has a solid development camp with Hockey Canada it could give him a big boost heading into the Rangers camp starting later this month. While the organization has said that Thomas will be getting a long, hard look at Thomas while he is in camp I do not think it means that he a lock by any means to make the team.
My expectation for Thomas is for him to have a strong development camp with both Hockey Canada and the Rangers (as well as have a good Traverse City tournament) but he will be sent back to the OHL to show that he can put up another 40+ goal season and so that he can participate in the WJC for Team Canada.
Take the dive for my in depth thoughts on Thomas and why I think he needs this one more season in the OHL and why the WJC will be a big step in his development
Christian Thomas has game breaking talent, putting up 50+ goals in the OHL is nothing to sneeze at, as well as putting up 19 points (9 goals and 10 assists) in 10 playoff games for the Oshawa Generals. The kid has a great shot and knows how to go to the net while playing a north-south style of game, his vision and hockey sense are all top notch for a 19 year old prospect.
But that's just it, CT is still a prospect, albeit a top flight prospect. He has all the tools and all the weapons but he still has to learn how to put all of it together and the NHL is not the place for a kid fresh out of the OHL to try and "put it all together", Michael Del Zotto can attest to that.
Now on to the WJC, we all know that the tournament features some of the best young talent in hockey and that these kids come to play. Its a good high intensity test for young prospects to see how they perform in such a high intensity, short series tournament. We've seen how other Ranger prospects fared in the WJC, Derek Stepan alone was one of the best players in the 2010 tournament and the Rangers contingent made a big impact for the gold medal winning Team USA.
To put it all together, this upcoming season could be a very productive one for Thomas if he stays with the OHL and participates in the World Juniors. Yes he put up 50 goals in the OHL, but so did Ryan Callahan who did it in his last year in the OHL, I'm not comparing the two because they are two different player types, but Thomas has the skill to repeat that as he is expected to.
Alright guys what are your thoughts?
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forwards and defenseman are a little different. IMO pure goal scorers have the smoothest transition into the NHL because their game is less influenced by the increased speed of the game and size and strength of the other players. They are adept at finding open spaces, and a great shot is a great shot is a great shot.
Obviously there will be a learning curve, but I think goal scoreres can only accomplish so much at the ahl level before making the move to the NHL. I think the real question is if the Rangers have room for a guy who is going to be dangerous offensively, but may be a defensive liability for his first few seasons. The other concern is his size and strength. Are NHL guys going to simply break him? All things being equal, I’d say he is ready though.
Not in front of my computer, but I believe nigel dawes scored 50 in the little leagues, and qe know how that turned out.
I save my excitement until someone achieves something in a big boys league.
If he can score like his dad, he will be fine.
by GAThingy on Aug 10, 2011 10:58 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
I think you have to look deeper than just the goal total
I think you have to look at how certain players score their goals. Do they benefit from having world class players on their line constantly setting them up for goals? Do they use their size and strength to simply bully guys in front of the net and score garbage goals, but have underdeveloped skills?
Not sure what Dawes’ game was like in the OHL, but it seems like Thomas uses an elite shot to score most of his goals. I just think it’s a bit different.
Size.
Hockey future has him listed at 5-9" 162lbs. Thats 10lbs smaller than MZA. That is just too small for the NHL. Especially when the kid has 3-4 years before he is done growing, there is no need to rush it. While i think his skill set makes him ready to play against the men in the AHL, his size is just a year behind.
do you really think Thomas is going to continue growing into his body until he’s 22-23 years old?
I mean come on now…this isn’t Matt Gilroy we’re talking about here..
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"It's just pain."
This team has balls.
"we need to get cam newton before the panther’s get off lock down cause eli cant (QB) by hisselfall this saeson also we need plax back to cause smith is the best (WR) we got nd plax cant help smith nd the team out….. do that nd we have a a shout at the superblow" -Anon
by Master Ov Brutality on Aug 10, 2011 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
It’s not impossible to be successful at that size. Sure, I can only come up with one active example (Steve Sullivan), but he’s a helluva player. Skill will overwhelm size if there’s enough of it.
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by George E. Ays on Aug 10, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
martin st. louis
since that’s the popular comparison for smaller skill guys, is listed at 5’9 177 lbs
so if thomas puts on another 10 lbs, who knows
theo fleury played at 5’6 170ish during his heydey, it’s not out of the question
@joereiter
"You can be a lion maybe once in your life. If you don't make this deal, you're a
mouse forever….Wouldn't you rather be a lion for one day than a mouse for life?" - Lord General Sather
"Nobody knows anything" - William Goldman
Theo was awesome...
Anybody else remember him pushing anson carter out the way to punch the guy in the face who had atleast 6 inches on him
by Ranger McJersey on Aug 10, 2011 1:36 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
You might see that in some of the MSG Vault shots...
I was watching the nasty bench-clearer between the Rangers and Maple Leafs from the 60’s. Those were knockdown-drag out! Eddie Giacomin ate that opposing goalie’s dinner for him. Arse-whooping for everybody. I’m sure there was a microbe or two on either bench.
"The winner of the Steven McDonald Extra Effort Award is Number Eight, Brandon Prust!"--Ofc. Colin McDonald, NYPD, April 7, 2011
"Charlie Harper died in a 'Meat' explosion." Rose, of Two and a Half Men, September 19, 2011
"I'm a doctor, not a barber, Jim." Dr. McCoy to Captain Kirk
btw
thomas is listed at 164-165 now
@joereiter
"You can be a lion maybe once in your life. If you don't make this deal, you're a
mouse forever….Wouldn't you rather be a lion for one day than a mouse for life?" - Lord General Sather
"Nobody knows anything" - William Goldman
And as far as I can tell..
the summer isn’t over. He might just pack on 10 more pounds. I think he will be fine, and has the gifts to make it here right now..if given the chance.
"The winner of the Steven McDonald Extra Effort Award is Number Eight, Brandon Prust!"--Ofc. Colin McDonald, NYPD, April 7, 2011
"Charlie Harper died in a 'Meat' explosion." Rose, of Two and a Half Men, September 19, 2011
"I'm a doctor, not a barber, Jim." Dr. McCoy to Captain Kirk
We have one of the best teams we had in awhile and we are just going to get better there is no need to rush the kid…
by Ranger McJersey on Aug 10, 2011 2:26 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Thus the reason I said…“given the chance”.
"The winner of the Steven McDonald Extra Effort Award is Number Eight, Brandon Prust!"--Ofc. Colin McDonald, NYPD, April 7, 2011
"Charlie Harper died in a 'Meat' explosion." Rose, of Two and a Half Men, September 19, 2011
"I'm a doctor, not a barber, Jim." Dr. McCoy to Captain Kirk
Only issues with Thomas
As a few people have mentioned in this thread he’s small (listed at 5’9" 164 lbs. probably means something more like 5’7" and 159 lbs. realistically). While he still might be growing, it’s safest to work with the assumption that he probably won’t ever play much bigger than 5’10" and 170 lbs. This isn’t necessarily a problem – that’s very comparable to Patrick Kane, the only thing is the player needs to have a strong enough core to not get pushed off the puck and know how to use quickness and speed to create some space for them to create a shot or passing lane. While it would be ideal if Thomas was a 6’2" 215 lb. monster, he’s not, so the concern there is whether he learns to play successfully with his size when he gets to the NHL eventually. Camp will be a good time to learn how he handles this situation.
Another issue with Thomas that I’ve read about and also heard from guys who have played with him is that he’s too much of a puck-chucker. Basically, anytime he’s given an inch he takes his shot. His shot itself is apparently incredible, both hard and absurdly accurate. But you can’t be a successful goal scorer if you don’t know how to create a proper chance or keep defenders on their toes. While he had plenty of assists to go along with his goals in the OHL, you have to wonder how many of those assists were actually passes from Thomas and how many were put-away goals on rebounds given up by inferior goaltenders. It’s an issue to keep an eye on, we should all keep a close eye on him when MSG airs the Traverse City Tournament.
It may seem like I’m bashing Thomas; I’m not, and I’m a big fan of his. Scoring that many goals doesn’t happen by accident, and it’s a very impressive number for a guy after his draft year. I just threw this out there as a discussion for a few of the potential issues with his game.
I think if he plays on a line with the right people, putting a lot of rubber on the net isn’t a bad thing
I agree, and for a long time I’ve been hoping for the Rangers to get a guy who’s got a nasty shot and isn’t afraid to let the puck go (i.e. Jeff Carter, especially his 40 goal season). My point isn’t that shooting a bunch is a bad thing, and I agree that having him shoot a lot if guys like Cally are on his line to bang the puck home is great for the team. What I mean is more that when he gets the puck he always tries to get a shot off, which is a problem when you get to the NHL because players are so good and teams are so smart that once they sniff out a guy’s tendencies they can render him far less effective than he normally would be. Look at what’s happened to Ovechkin the last few years (although the reason for his drop in goals is another debate), and think about what teams did to take away Chara’s effectiveness on the PP in the playoffs.
Cliff Notes version: my concern is that if he’s a one-dimensional player (meaning get the puck and shoot it every time), teams will figure out that dimension and take it away from him, leaving him a bit dead in the water. If he’s a smart shooter who knows how to pick his opportunities, then that’s a whole different ball game.
He’ll learn to pick his moments. It’s inevitable. I’d like to know if he’s good at making space for himself; a good shot’s not enough in the NHL.
Take it to the net and keep jamming and jamming until somebody comes on you.
- Eddie Olczyk
by Scratch and Snif on Aug 11, 2011 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Shooter learn how to get their shot off. He doesn’t need to be Mike Gartner, I’d settle for something between Steve Larmer and Ray Sheppard…maybe a Pat Verbeek.
If your over 30 years of age you’ll get what I’m saying.
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Aug 10, 2011 5:19 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
I get it. Pat Verbeek would be nice.
by It may HAVE to Last a Lifetime on Aug 10, 2011 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Whoa im 25 and I understand… lol
by Ranger McJersey on Aug 10, 2011 5:54 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I’m 33 and sometime I reference players and people are like WTF. For example, I’d be very happy if Tim Erixon was another James Patrick. Does that make sense to you?
by Gabby the Gutless Sniper on Aug 10, 2011 8:04 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Now at 37, I can reference a few names, too. For example, referencing Christian Thomas to Joe Mullen, Dylan McIlrath to Ulf Samuelsson, Ryan McDonagh to Ron Greschner, and Tim Erixon to Dave Maloney.
Good enough?
"The winner of the Steven McDonald Extra Effort Award is Number Eight, Brandon Prust!"--Ofc. Colin McDonald, NYPD, April 7, 2011
"Charlie Harper died in a 'Meat' explosion." Rose, of Two and a Half Men, September 19, 2011
"I'm a doctor, not a barber, Jim." Dr. McCoy to Captain Kirk
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