Players The Rangers Should Try To Acquire
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 15, 2012 1:03 AM EST
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PrintHere's a list I compiled of players the Rangers should try to get at the deadline:
Doubt the Isles would trade with us but Frans Nielsen
Really doubt the Aves would do this but Milan Hejduk.
Tuomo Ruutu (he's becoming a hot commodity)
Jason Garrison (he'll get a nice pay day next year)
Lubomir Visnovsky
That's my list of people that are reasonable. All the above mentioned players are on a rental except Visnovsky. They make the most sense.
With Florida starting to fade a bit I would really like to see the Rangers get Garrison. He could easily solve our PP woes and he has a huge shot from the point. Same goes for Visnovsky.
Still think Shane Doan is our best option at forward and then there's Tuomo Ruutu. Paul Gaustad really dominates the faceoff circle and can chip in a bit of offense. Depending on how the Sabres fair I can see them trading him.
Who do you guys like of the list? Also, please don't mention Ales Hemsky, Alex Semin, and Zach Parise. Shea Weber and Ryan Suter are definitely options also but only at the right price which is why I didn't mention them above.
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the best player they should try to get is ...
nobody
"There are some people who, if they don't already know, you can't tell 'em." - Yogi
Boyes or Prospal would be nice, and they shouldn’t cost much at all.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Wouldn’t love or hate a trade, would depend on who we get. I personally would love to see a trade for Doan; could make for some potentially lethal depth.
AA-BR-Gabby
Doan-Dubi-Cally
Hagelin-Boyle-Stepan
Feds-Rupp-Mitchell
Just imagine a line of Dubi, Cally, and Doan there would be enough jam for Torts to climax.
Of course in order to get Doan, one of those players is likely to be going to the desert.
by Zuppa Di Pesce on Jan 15, 2012 2:28 AM EST up reply actions
Well, that’s why I like a guy like Boyes.
Buffalo is doing terrible, and there is no reason for them not to trade him.
Through Zucs and a pick/prospect or whatever at them, and he can be had.
AA Step Gabby
Wolski BR Cally
Hags Dubi Boyes
Feds Boyle Prust
Mitchell Rupp
That would be sweet.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Eh
I used to like Boyes, but he really hasn’t been that good in in the past 2 years and it seems like his seasons are very streaky. I’d pass.
"You fucking loser!" - Sean Avery
"Just reload my weapon, you know?" - Artem Anisimov
The future is looking bright boys.
Dubi is not going back to center especially if that means putting Stephan on the 3rd line RW.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 15, 2012 5:46 AM EST up reply actions
Well, I think the lines aren’t what matters too much, especially with Torts. None of us are going to predict what he chooses.
What matters is the guys we have.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
boyes?? hahahah what a joke no!
the only guys I see comig would be prospal.. or smyth.. but prospal seems a better fit for chemistry with our club already.. we should have never let him go, like i said prospal is a true leader.. he could play well with richards or gabroiks line, and we need additional scoring for the playoffs. and role players like him.. it would be nice to get a young fast speedster star , but that would cost us much, if we put a package we could trade some players for a elite caliber left winger or right winger if we want i just wouldnt know who to give up at this point..??
by Stuart Pinnetti on Jan 15, 2012 3:39 AM EST reply actions
I rather not have an elite guy because they demand large contracts, and I would rather not have four players all making over 6.5 mil. Not a good idea IMO.
Just wondering, why is a guy like Boyes a joke to you?
He’s almost a like for ~50 points, and very rarely gets injured.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
he isn't on the rangers roster,
so he sucks, obviously. That’s how it seems to work with 90 percent of the posters here, right? We don’t need to improve, we have 60 points, duh! Best team in the NHLzz, cup here we come, as constructed we are the bestest team, prob maybe the best in duh history of the leeg. We don’t want other player, unless it is Iginila or Statsny in a salary dump, since they obviously would w2ant to come 2 ny and hold thare organizations hostage to get it done.
a player who can play both center and wing would be nice!! faceoffs, and scoring..
WE NEED MORE SKILL AND SCORING!!! TOO MANY GRINDERS AND SLOW GUYS ON OUR TEAM..
SPEED SKILL, PLAYMAKING, VISION, STRENGHTH SIZEE, SCORING ABILTY AND ALL IN ONE PLAYERS IN COMPLETE PLAYERS IS WHAT WERE LACKING.
pure raw talent… number one picks……kane, toews. like skinner, eric stall. lucic.. briere.. parise , spezza, ignila. a guy who can just grab and carry the team and score at any given time whos always battling.. like a messier…. a guy who can simply amaze and get threw evveryone and score..
by Stuart Pinnetti on Jan 15, 2012 3:47 AM EST reply actions
yea, we’re not gonna get one of those guys in a trade, and we’re not going to tank enough to land one in the draft. So forget it.
That’s why we’re building a team, with speed, grit, and toughness. Its a team game, and we don’t need one of those names above to win.
I think we need one of those guys to win.
I am as happy as anybody about how good the Rangers are playing, but I wouldn’t be surprised if they went out in the first round as a number 1 seed. They just aren’t a dominant team, they don’t create enough offense. Seems like a waste to just stand pat when we have a chance at contending this year, because we think we don’t need to improve.
Don’t lump me in with all the other posters your angry at…
I never said they’re dominant, and I never said to stand pat. But overpaying for a top-end talent as a rental is not the right way to go. We wanna trade for depth, or a player that’ll fit into this team’s identity. But its gotta fit with this team. I actually think we need to improve our bottom 6 a little bit. But we don’t need one of the guys on the above list to win… there are other options.
We’re in the current situation because of how they’ve been patient in building the team. Don’t stray from that formula because we’re kinda close.
responding to a comment of yours means im angry at you?
funny, reading my post, then reading yours, I only sense hostility coming from your entry. A bit defensive there chap.
TRAID FOR MESSYER
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 15, 2012 9:50 AM EST up reply actions
kane, toews. like skinner, eric stall. lucic.. briere.. parise , spezza, ignila. a guy who can just grab and carry the team and score at any given time whos always battling.. like a messier
Like a Messier? Briere, Spezza, and Skinner are Messier’s? Only people you can even compare to the messiah on your list is eric staal, iginla, and maybe toews.
Why must you troll this thread?
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 15, 2012 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
not maybe Toews,
definitely Toews. If you’re starting a Franchise, he’s the exact type of player you want to build around
Take it to the net and keep jamming and jamming until somebody comes on you.
- Eddie Olczyk
by Scratch and Snif on Jan 15, 2012 6:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Ahem
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
HE’Z NOT MESSYIERZ!?!11
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
But he’s just what this team needs
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
Which is part of the reason why I would, in many ways, rather just sit pretty on deadline day and go with the kids we have. I might be interested in renting a player like Whitney or Prospal but only if the price is right (which is to say a very, very low price).
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
Not sure about the contract
But Ales Hemsky? I’ve been busy this winter break and need to get into trade season mode
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
I have zero interest in Hemsky. Injury-prone. Meh.
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
ok…that settles that
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
What a joke
"You fucking loser!" - Sean Avery
"Just reload my weapon, you know?" - Artem Anisimov
The future is looking bright boys.
hey cammalerri would have been a god fit here! pure lamp lighter with gabroik and stepan
by Stuart Pinnetti on Jan 15, 2012 3:48 AM EST reply actions
Grinders are generally the fastest skaters. And comparing ourselves to most other teams, we don’t seem to have much problem scoring.
We play our grinding game, tire teams out, and score when we need to off of good defensive players. If you haven’t noticed, that’s how you when playoff games.
If you want a team with skill and scoring, but no toughness, size, or defensive ability, look at MTL.
Seems to be working for them, huh?
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
I don't get how you can say scoring isn't a problem when we are out shot every single night, and a lot of times 2 to 1
Do you think that the roster of players we have had for years now suddenly just learned to become great scorers? I don’t, I think it’s a noisy sample size that will eventually level out. I think the Rangers can legitimately compete for a cup, but I think it’s silly to assume we don’t need anybody and stand pat. I hate this attitude of overvaluing our own players and prospects. For the first time in 15 years, we have a serious chance to make a run at a cup, and we want to stand pat and keep all of our youth. We are not rebuilding anymore, this is why we rebuilt. Too pass on a real star scorer to hope a prospect turns out in 2 or 3 years would be foolish in my opinion. One real, dynamic scorer that can take over a game is the only real piece we are missing. Somebody who can play the role Jagr played for us before he left for Russia.
Probably based on the fact that we are 11th in the league in scoring. 42 games is not that small of a sample size, anymore.
You are being pretty vocal about bringing in a scorer vs. sticking with our prospects, but the kind of scorer you are talking about wouldn’t cost us prospects, it would cost us core players – more than one. I think most of us are OK with trading unproven prospects for proven elite talent, but we are not OK with undoing what we rebuilt for it. Gaborik is supposed to be our Jagr and B Richards is supposed to be elite talent. If you want to add another elite player you are going to have to give up a top 6 forward, a top 4 defenseman, and prospects and picks.
by BigB22 on Jan 16, 2012 12:41 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
When the games are close, the Rangers are outshooting at a pretty regular clip right now. At even strength, we’ve only been outshot twice in the last 10 games. We haven’t been outshot 2-1 at evens all season.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 16, 2012 12:47 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yes, 1st chance in 15 years
But it will not be the last within the next 5 if we stay with the kids, develop them the right way, and not spend too much $$$$$$$$ on players so we actually have cap space and can make a move if needed.
"You fucking loser!" - Sean Avery
"Just reload my weapon, you know?" - Artem Anisimov
The future is looking bright boys.
Im not saying gut the core prospects
im just saying everybody shouldn’t be so content to just stand pat thinking we are going to win a cup as currently constructed. For the first time in years we are in position to be real buyers. If our system is this good, you should have faith in us replenishing it. Look at a team like Pittsburgh, they seem to buy at the deadline every year, often times a big pricetag player, but they still keep bringing up young talent. We are in position to make a deep cup run, but we need a little more help.
Yes we are, and we still will be next year, we will actually be better with all of our kids having another year under their belt and everything. Just stay patient, let this year come and go as it should (unless a perfect deal comes along, I.E. a steal for Ryan or whomever) and the next 2 or 3 years if we need to add someone at the time, then we could. But right now, no please, we’re still a very young team and this is the 1st successful year after a rebuild, we are also still developing good players, don’t trade any of the kids this year please, just be patient. Everything will fall into place.
"You fucking loser!" - Sean Avery
"Just reload my weapon, you know?" - Artem Anisimov
The future is looking bright boys.
meh
We play our grinding game, tire teams out, and score when we need to off of good defensive players. If you haven’t noticed, that’s how you when playoff games.
You make it sound so easy. We can’t just decide to get a goal every time we need to like this is NHL 2012. At a certain point, being out shot every single night and not putting any pressure on the opposing goalie which come back and haunt us. I know we are the number one seed, but does that actually even mean anything? Number 1 seeds get knocked out in the first and second round every year. It’s not like we can just say hey, we are number 1, we obviously don’t need to improve.
Also, I’m pretty sure Stuart didn’t say he wanted the Montreal Canadians. He said he wanted somebody who could score on his own, and you went off on a tangent asking him how Montreal is doing. He said he wanted a scorer to compliment our entire roster of similar grinding type players. He didn’t say lets swap rosters.
God forbid somebody wants to improve the team it’s like considered blasphemy.
A “god fit”? Wow, we are silly not to have gotten him then.
Torts wouldn’t have liked Cammy’s mouth and attitude that got him into trouble in Habstown.
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
Doan, a no-brainer and Prospal as a back-up plan. Other than that, unless Weber/Suter become available, then I would not do anything. Ryan will be too cost prohibitive IMO.
CBC’s Elliotte Freidman (who rocks, I recommend reading his 30 Thoughts column every week…) thinks PHO will definitely not trade Doan and want to resign him at the end of the season. We’ll see come February where they stand.
thanks, actually I do read it and you’re right it’s very good. I’ve read as well that he’s not available which to me is a smoke screen to up the price. Doan is 35 and Don Maloney is the type of guy to reward Doan with a chance to win if Doan allows the move. I believe the decision for trade is totally Doan’s either way (to stay or to go).
I think this post is just a statement
against trading for big name guys…just as hypothetical and unreasonable in the other direction IMO
@btown46
Making a move for some of the big names that have been thrown around wouldn't be a bad thing
As it stands we’ve got a lot of young players playing above expectations, and alot more coming up in the system. We’re looking at a system that’s very close to having more pegs then holes in the near future.
On Defense – Staal, Girardi, McD, Sauer, and MDZ now, with McIl, and Erixson waiting in the wings. That’s 7 bodies for 6 spots, and wow it’s nice to say “All our defensemen are home grown” it’s kind of more of a luxury then a necessity. I’m confident we can dig up a decent 3rd pair in any upcoming season. All we need is a few able bodies to stand in front of Hank. If we can use one or two of those bodies to secure a guy like Shea Weber, who gives us everything we’ve been lacking on the blue line for years to come, that’s a GREAT move for us.
Up front we’ve made significant commitments to Gabby, BR, Cally, and Dubi, and seem to view AA, Step, and Hagelin as part of our “young core” while the arrival of prospects like Christan Thomas, Chris Kreider and JT Miller is planned for in the near future. That’s 10 bodies being projected for top 6 roles. Again, plenty of depth to make a move for one of the proven players whose names have been tossed around, if we chose to make a move with a team like Anaheim or Columbus for a forward. Bringing in another body who you know is going to go out, and put up their 30+ goals every season is never a bad thing.
It’s great that we’re seeing results from young guys now, but the reality is, that some of them are going to STAY at this level. The other part of Gordie’s job is to let Slats know WHO those guys are, so we can sell high, and hopefully use them to bring in some proven talent.
If your trying to win it all this year then stay away from Rick Nash, Bobby Ryan, and Getzlaf.
I’d rather wait and have all of our young guys ready to go and then ship them away. We don’t know how Kreider, Thomas, and Miller will turn out. I’m not trading Dubinsky right now based on what any of those guys will become.
Another option is if you want to keep the whole team together forever you can get rid of Gaborik when his contract is on his last year and shed some serious cap.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 15, 2012 2:35 PM EST up reply actions
Why are you staying away from Nash, Ryan, and Getzlaf if you want to win this year? Nash is the biggest post season question mark of the three, but he’s a guy who’s been able to get his 30 goals with almost no help his whole career. Unless the scouts see something in their games right now, that’s different, Getzlaf and Ryan are guys who have shown they’ll produce all year and turn it up in the post season. They have both struggled a bit this season, but the whole team has. Any of those guys are right in the mix with our top scorers, and have been producing in more difficult situations.
You are right that "we don’t know how Kreider, Thomas, and Miller will turn out, but it’s a stretch to think any one of them will be as good as any of the 3 guys above. That’s not a knock on any of those prospects, just a realization about how difficult it is to be an elite NHL player, who stays healthy and produces.
Keeping everyone isn’t a practical option, and would be a waste of resources. You don’t need top 4 defensemen wasting away in the bottom pair, or top 6 forwards fighting for minutes in the bottom 6. We’ve can get alot of value for these guys now, while our team is winning and they’re all playing well.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 15, 2012 6:01 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Out of the big three you want us to land who are you most interested in and why? (I should say big 4 if you are still hungry for Weber as a Ranger).
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
Weber is the perfect fit for us on D, and I think we have the right parts to make a deal happen with Nashville. Of the forwards, I think Bobby Ryan would be the best target, he’s young, his price is a bit more reasonable, and I could see him working on a wing opposite Gabby or on a line with BR. Getzlaf worries me a bit, since he’s a center, we’ve already got BR, and Gabby doesn’t necessarily mesh with centers easily.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 15, 2012 6:50 PM EST up reply actions
So you’d rather go Weber or Bobby Ryan?
Ryan could probably be had for less. The asking price for Weber would be absolutely staggering IMO.
@DigDeepNYR
"It's just pain." -Brandon Prust | "In Prust we Trust."
Blueshirt Banter
Therein lies the rub. No doubt Ryan and Weber would help this team but you when you weigh what they bring to this team against what we’d lose, they don’t seem like appealing options.
by Zuppa Di Pesce on Jan 15, 2012 7:49 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t think you’re really going to lose that much if our players are as good as WE think they all are, As I said above, you pretty much let them take any roster player they want in the same position and add on prospects/picks from the pile we soon won’t have enough room for anyway to make up the difference.
In either deal, I think you’re talking about like 3 players. In the case of Weber, the Preds are going to want something close to 4 #1’s they can get if he walks. If you let them take Staal or Girardi, who Weber replaces anyway, I’d say that equals 2 of the #1 picks (a bird in hand is worth 2 in the bush, right?) then we give them our #1 this year, and another prospect. You put WW on top of that deal, do give us the space we need and help keep them at the floor. Not a HUGE price for a team that’s pretty well stocked, especially since our #1 is going to be low this year anyway.
If it’s Ryan we’re going after, I think we could build a deal around McD and a prospect. That would put a bit of a hole on the blueline, but there’s a few vet UFA’s out there we could get in a minor deal (Gleason come to mind in CAR) who could fill that hole for the rest of the season.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 16, 2012 10:14 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Weber would only place Girardi, being he’s a right handed shot. Suter would replace Staal (or McDonagh)
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by George E. Ays on Jan 16, 2012 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
There in lies the rub. Are we much better as a team with Suter-Girardi then Staal-Girardi? And if its McD going the other way there will have to be even more added to the deal from our side. And how do we afford Suter, Staal and Girardi?
Staal-Weber is more intriguing but just Girardi isn’t going to get that done and I would wonder if the end result would not be much of an upgrade. Its not like we would shut out every team just by added a better dman. There has to be a point of diminishing returns. I could understand if you needed help on the back-end that this would make sense but defensive is not our weak point.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 16, 2012 11:36 AM EST up reply actions
Making the move for Weber is basically taking Staal/Girardi to the shop, and upgrading their shot, play with the puck, and physical game. We are better with any combination of our current top 4 D, minus ANY PLAYER from that group, and PLUS Shea Weber.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 16, 2012 1:29 PM EST up reply actions
Sure, but it matters what else you give up.
Also, Girardi at 3.3 mil or whatever he makes is more valuable than a guy like Suter at 6.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Girardi is playing far above expectations at 3.3, and your NEVER going to get a guy like Weber for less then 6. The guy is a rare player. With a $6 mil cap hit, Weber is worth every penny.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 8:53 AM EST up reply actions
At 6 mil, Weber is worth it, but Suter? Not to me. Not when Girardi can be signed for 3.3
The cap exists, and in order to have a good team you need good players on cost-efficient contracts. We already have 3 players making a boat load of money, and that needs to be balanced out..
I’d be fine for trading for better players, but this site gets very frustrating when posters, you included, throw out ridiculousness trade scenarios that make our team worse in order to get the “star” player.
I mean people want to give up Dubi, Kreider, Erixon, and a 1st for Ryan. It’s insane.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Agree I wouldn’t pay Suter 6, but he’s much better than Girardi. Defensively, he’s slightly better than Weber, at least by anything one can do to separate out their performances.
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*Statement has not been verified nor regressed
by George E. Ays on Jan 17, 2012 2:38 PM EST up reply actions
Well, on the other hand, if you go purely for value on contracts, you’ll end up with Giroux, Letang, Girardi, and a bunch of grinders (not counting ELCs). Sometimes to reach that top level of talent you need to overpay (Richards).
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I believe in next year.
by red army line on Jan 17, 2012 1:14 PM EST up reply actions
Oh for sure, but we already have Gabby, and Richie, and Hank making big bucks to be the skilled guys.
You need to have good players with cost-efficient contracts to match that, or else you run out of money.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
right… not sure we can add another player making 6+ mil, without dropping one of those you mentioned.
In the short term, you can pretty much make a deal, and ship out WW as part of it to your cap space.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 6:20 PM EST up reply actions
There’s enough bodies in the mix that we could get our Left and Right shots sorted out, regardless of who we send the other way. Getting the shooter we need is MUCH more important then the stick hand of the guy we send back. I think Weber and Suter are both very good players, but Weber is the better of the two, and better fit for us.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 16, 2012 1:27 PM EST up reply actions
I have zero interest in Semin/Hemsky/Parise.
Can’t help but have interest in players like Suter and Weber if they are on the market. Personally, I think if one of them moves the other is staying put. They can find a way to afford one of them.
The asking price for guys like Suter and Weber is going to be disgustingly high though. We already know that the Flyers are hungry for a d-man (Toronto’s Schenn or Suter/Weber) and I hate the idea of getting into a bidding war with them.
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To clarify- I only have zero interest in Parise for two reasons:
1. The Devils would never, ever, ever, ever trade him to us.
2. He has one year left and we’d lose him in free agency after we got fleeced in the trade.
Also, his first name is “Zach”.
@DigDeepNYR
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I agree about Semin and Hemsky. I want to agree on Parise, but he is pretty slick. There’s ZERO chance NJ makes a deal with us, and our history with Devs players makes me fine with passing on him.
Suter or Weber would be HUGE for us. Like I said in that other thread, we’ve got the pieces, and the chances that ANYONE on our team, or in our system becomes Weber is slim to none. Girardi is having a good season, and got an all star nod, but that’s just another day at the office for Weber, AND Weber is better with the puck.
I think that what we can offer in a combination of roster players and some picks prospects could make our offer VERY appealing to Nashville. Nashville isn’t just looking to unload Weber and get a bunch of cheap prospects to rebuild with, they want to stay competitive. You’ve got to be willing to include Staal or Girardi, and accept that Weber is an upgrade over either one of them, so it’s still gonna be OK. Philly isn’t looking to upgrade at D, they’re looking to fill the hole left by Pronger, so they’re not going to want to send anyone back who is a part of that team right now.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 15, 2012 6:20 PM EST up reply actions
We COULD just bid for the sake of bringing their prices up, then have Philly screw themselves over to get them
Take it to the net and keep jamming and jamming until somebody comes on you.
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by Scratch and Snif on Jan 15, 2012 6:20 PM EST up reply actions
Which is a lot like pulling the trigger two or three times when it is your turn in Russian Roulette because you are increasing the odds of the bullet going off when you pass the gun to the other guy.
A dangerous game.
@DigDeepNYR
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Not quite, because you could always pull out of a trade that you suggested if they ever do take up the offer. The only real problem is that it could scar our trading rep, but that would have happened anyway if Sather keeps fleecing people
Take it to the net and keep jamming and jamming until somebody comes on you.
- Eddie Olczyk
by Scratch and Snif on Jan 15, 2012 10:16 PM EST up reply actions
Still a very dangerous game to play. Why risk it?
@DigDeepNYR
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Thank you.
Somebody who gets it, and isn’t too enamored and in love with every homegrown player to delude himself into thinking we have an elite roster. It’s good, but the biggest mistake good teams make is thinking they are better, and not trying to improve. We have tons of depth, and a lot more down below, if we have to give up some young fan favorites to get a real difference maker, whether it be Weber as you said, or whether it be for Ryan or Statsny or Parise, that one piece could be the difference between hanging another banner in the rafters. As much as it would hurt to lose some young homegrown guys, this is the business and you have to make tough decisions to win in sports.
Stastny is dogging worse than B Richards, not sure where you slot him in as a drastic improvement over what we have. Scoring winger would be better.
im not talking specific personnel.
My main issue is that no matter who is brought up, nobody wants anything to do with it. Everybody wants to stand pat. I have a problem with the idea of not doing anything assuming everybody we have keeps improving and all of our prospects hit their ceiling. I don’t care about Statsny he just popped into my head. It’s about always improving your team, not sentimentality. That’s my problem generally with a lot of the fan base.
the problem is not wanting to make trades it’s the PRICE that those trades will cost you. who wouldn’t want Ryan and if Dubi (my 2nd favorite player on the team) gets me Ryan then I drive him to the airport. But it’s not just Dubi. It’s Dubi + Kredier? + 1st round pick to start. That’s too steep to get someone who is not THAT much better than Dubi. Now if you can get Ryan for Thomas, Erixon, maybe another prospect not named Kreider, Miller, or McIlrath, and a 1st round pick then I’m all for it. It’s not who we want, it’s the cost to get a player. That’s why my preference is Doan or Prospal. Both would provide bottom 6 scoring depth we don’t have now to create a more balanced line-up and so as not to have to gut the team to get one or the other. No one is against improving the team or trading home grown players (which I prefer myself quite honestly) but it depends on the overall cost.
by Richter1994 on Jan 16, 2012 1:11 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
this
sums up everything
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 16, 2012 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
That’s too steep to get someone who is not THAT much better than Dubi.
Ryan is ALOT better then Dubi. In his 4th NHL season, Ryan is on pace for his 4th 30 goal season. Ryan is young, cheap for what he gives you, and still getting better.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 9:03 AM EST up reply actions
I disagree based on the Rangers’ style of play which I think you are disregarding in comparing Dubi vs. Ryan. Dubi does so many things that don’t show up on the stat sheet. the last 2 of 3 games is an indicator that he was missed. I’ll bet anything the Rangers have a lot more energy tonight if he is back in the line-up and BR plays better.
I agree that Dubi does alot of different things for this team, and I don’t think that he has to be the only name that comes up in a trade for Ryan. I’ll even say that what Dubi’s game offers with his mix of skill,grinding, and willingness to to fight might be BETTER to keep around in a trade for an established top-6 talent, then one of our current skill guys, who would inevitably be knocked out of the top 6, and might not be as effective in bottom 6 minutes.
I’d part with any one of our forwards outside of BR if it meant we could bring in Ryan. The kid is gifted, we have good players, but this kid is just better. I’d say you could include any forward, one of Sauer or McD, and one of Kreider/Thomas/Miller/1st rd pick and this team would improve right now, and wouldn’t miss a beat in the future. I’m not necessarily saying we HAVE to pay that much, I’m just saying we COULD pay that much without hurting ourselves.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 1:08 PM EST up reply actions
Any forward? I hope Gabby, Step, AA, and Cally aren’t included in that.
Because if you are willing to give up one of those, McD, and Kreider for Ryan..
Oh boy…
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by George E. Ays on Jan 17, 2012 2:38 PM EST up reply actions
Cally, McD and Kreider for Ryan.
Somewhere an angel just threw up.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 17, 2012 2:44 PM EST up reply actions
Watch out...
crazy Buck is at it again.
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First off, I was pointing out that with our depth, you COULD give away any forward on the current roster (who gets upgraded when they are replaced by Ryan), either McD or Sauer (we’ve been doing just fine w/o Sauer while he’s been hurt, and I think he and McD are pretty even) and any one of our forward prospects (you’ve got BR and Ryan, possibly Gabby too, driving a line each for the forseeable future, and there’s only 6 ‘top 6’ spots that need filling) and you would IMPROVE this team right now, without leaving any big holes in our current, or future lineup.
Think of it this way… imagine if Chris Kreider was a bonafide NHL stud, ready to step into the league and start throwing together 30 goal seasons TONIGHT. Not MAYBE he will be, no talk about what he COULD be, it’s guaranteed. This kid will score 30 goals and put up 60+ points a season. You’d put him in the lineup right? He could have whoever’s ice time he wanted. Gabby, Step, AA, Cally… any of them could get bumped from the top 6 got him. In essence, if you make a trade where you have to include a top prospect, and one of those guys, that’s exactly what you’re doing. Becoming a player like Bobby Ryan is the wildest dream of any of our prospects. We’re guaranteeing that 1 of them becomes that, and that they become that player TODAY.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 3:23 PM EST up reply actions
I’m all for Ryan as he is all the things you are saying. I just am afraid of the cost to get him. I’ll tell you one guy that is playing himself off this team or to the bottom 6 is AA. I don’t know what’s with him. he’s so talented but there’s something missing with him. he’s just not confident I guess. my friend just text me saying Boomer Easison was talking about how the Rangers are in talks for Nash. but who would you give up? and Nash is $7.8M per.
The kid has made big strides the past few years an now is playing out of position and being put in more of a defensive role on that line.
Put him back between Dubi and Cally and then see what happens.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 17, 2012 2:38 PM EST up reply actions
Really? Why? Its not like Cally or Dubi for that matter are having run away seasons. Don’t get me wrong, Cally has played very well but if you are saying there is great chemistry between him and BR I would expect different results.
I think Cally would produce around the same with AA as he did last year. I would look at it as an opportunity to find a winger who really meshes with BR.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 17, 2012 6:23 PM EST up reply actions
because I think Cally and Dubi provide the grittiness BR needs to play his game and be effective. for some reason Richards looks smaller to me than when he was with Dallas. he looks thinner and not as wide as I thought he was so his physical game is lacking not that he was so physical in Dallas to begin with. I am a big AA fan but I am seeing signs that he is not the player I thought he was or would be. He can easily be a bottom 6 player next year. maybe he’s more comfortable there. less stress.
I didn’t think BR played with any size/grit on his wings in Dallas and he was quite successful. Could it be an East thing? I agree it would be nice to have someone able to work the boards but I also one with more pure skating and shooting like Erikson was. I say we get that kid ;)
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 18, 2012 7:18 AM EST up reply actions
Just out of curiosity, how have we gone from just Staal for Ryan to now 2 important roster players + a top prospect for him?
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by George E. Ays on Jan 17, 2012 2:58 PM EST up reply actions
I’m not saying “blow it up”, I’m saying that other teams are considering “blowing it up”, we should be prepared, with our depth of prospects and cheaper young players to make an offer.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
NO!
WE DON’T NEED RYAN!!!!!!!!
LET THIS TEAM DO WHAT THEY CAN! GIVE THEM THEIR TIME!
Jesus, I’m so tired of everybody wanting to trade someone. Like holy shit. Oh we need this guy for a cup run, dammit we need a top 6 scorer if we want to make it far in the playoffs. The Rangers will never stay atop the NHL unless they get another scorer.
That won’t work! Why is everyone so impatient?!? Do you see what direction this team is headed in??? Do you see all of the youth and change and the system that is implemented upon the players that we draft? Do you think Gordie Clark is going to bring players onto this team who can’t play a complete game? Just relax, and give it time. We WILL be a dominant team. You guys just gotta be patient, as well as Sather.
"You fucking loser!" - Sean Avery
"Just reload my weapon, you know?" - Artem Anisimov
The future is looking bright boys.
You don't think Bobby Ryan's stock has risen in 2 years?
The kids numbers have kept improving, and back then, if you traded for him, you weren’t sure what it was going to cost to sign him. Now he’s locked into a VERY agreeable deal.
You don’t think we’d get laughed off the phone offering Staal for Ryan right now?
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 3:31 PM EST up reply actions
You don’t think we’d get laughed off the phone offering Staal for Ryan right now?
No, because the league has a lot more respect for Staal than you do, even w/ the concussion. As much as Ryan’s stock has risen, Staal’s better than then too. I’ll even concede that with the injury you can’t do that deal straight up any more. But you don’t have to throw in much more. No one denies Ryan is a very good player, but you don’t just keeping throwing in pieces for him because you can.
Sather would be run out of town for sending, for example, Stepan, McDonagh, and Kreider for Ryan. It’s ridiculously comical value to send for one guy.
There are expendable guys in the system, and sure, if we can get a guy like Ryan for pieces that won’t hurt too much, you do it. But you don’t deal all of them just for the sake of doing so, because then you’re gutted for the next time a player becomes available, that might just be more important than Ryan.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 17, 2012 4:09 PM EST up reply actions
Again, I said COULD to make the point that even if you sent that much, you’re not creating a hole in the lineup or the farm system. Can you really tell me that if we HAD to give away all three of those players to get an extra scorer, and stay under the cap, the team would suddenly be suspect in some part of their game? Ryan’s replacing Step, big bump there. We’ve still got Staal, Girardi, Sauer, MDZ, Stralman, Eminger, Woywitka, and Bickel here, (With McIll & Ericxon in the wings) to play in front of goalie who stops everything sees. IF Kreider becomes a top 6 guy, your fighting for a spot to put him with commitments to Gabby, BR, Cally, Dubi, and now Ryan. Plus guys like AA and Hagelin who are pegged as "sure things on here as well.
There so much concern about not giving up this guy, or that guy, because they will PROBABLY be really good in the future. We’re talking about a guy who’s really good now. On a 1 for 1, you could possibly get Ryan for Gabby, but given Gabby’s age, contract, and injury/consistency problems, I don’t see Anaheim jumping at that deal. That means that whoever we’d send in a trade, we’re going to have to send something with them. I mean, the purpose of the trade is to get better, if you’re bringing in a better player you going to have to send back more then the guy he’s replacing, and not just an AHL lifer.
If trades for guys like Lidstrom or Selanne were being proposed. Guys who are playing great hockey, but are on their last legs, I could see the outrage, but guys like Weber and Ryan are young, and would part of our teams future for years to come, but can also help us make the push while Hanks still on top of his game.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 6:43 PM EST up reply actions
Staal for Ryan?
That is insanely stupid why would we trade one of the best D-Men in the league?
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Ryan’s as dominant of a forward as Staal is a defenseman, if not more so. Also, we did pretty well without Staal the first half of the season, why not get someone who can help our REAL #1 defenseman, Henrik, and get us the goals we need to turn his efforts into wins.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 6:45 PM EST up reply actions
if not more so
Staal is a top 25 defenseman easy maybe even top 20.
Ryan is a borderline top 35 forward.
You seriously undervalue everyone on the rangers roster and this is just one example.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 17, 2012 6:57 PM EST up reply actions
Staals pretty much one dimensional player (drop back, stay at home defenseman) he’s also coming off a severe head injury. To say that teams are going to jump at him is a stretch. That being said, Staal could be the GREATEST ‘shut down defenseman" in the game today, but it wouldn’t change the fact that we’ve seen this team can win without him. Henrik is, conservatively, one of the 5 best goalies in the world. He needs scoring help so his efforts don’t go to waste.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 7:26 PM EST up reply actions
Dude is 15-20 points better, while being not as good at defense and not having the faceoff and PK ability that Dubi has.
Is he better? Yeah.
Is he worth Dubi, Kreider, Erixon, etc.? No.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Consider what the Rangers want to do in the offseason as well. If the Rangers are going to make a play for Weber or Parise and I doubt Parise is an option, I guess you do minimal at the deadline unless you get a rental. I’m not sure Bobby Ryan or Getzlaf is a real option now but what about long term?
Absolute Worst Ranger Fan!!!!!!....yet incredibly realistic and usually correct.
There's two guys that come to mind...
1. I know he’s coming off a concussion, and he looked well in his return the other night…Brian Rolston. A former Cup winner and a big shooter. Someone who can absolutely light it up on the power-play.
2. Hopefully, the throat will get better quickly; and as someone who is getting the power play points (6G, 2A)…I’d want Blake wheeler. His size (6’5", 210 lbs) is great, he has playoff experience, and doesn’t play small. His cap number, $2.55 million: he has 32 points (9G, 23A). This would be a solid pickup.
"Fart like a man! It's hockey!"
No, please no, please no, NO Rolston
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It really is. I hope that didn’t offend you, but he’s really awful. My brother (Islanders fan) almost cries every time he skates onto the ice.
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Wasn’t he hurt? I think he might take too much to get.
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He would take too much to get.
Winnipeg doesn’t really have a lot of pieces to move and they would almost certainly not want to part ways with one of the guys they are hoping to build the team around. Granted, he is more likely to be moved than Evander Kane or Ladd is, but he is on the right side of 30 and has a lot of potential. The asking price would be pretty big, even though I know for a fact that the Rangers were really, really interested in getting Wheeler when he didn’t sign Phoenix.
@DigDeepNYR
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Absolutely not on Rolston
And the Jets want to keep Wheeler, he could turn out to be a very good player.
"You fucking loser!" - Sean Avery
"Just reload my weapon, you know?" - Artem Anisimov
The future is looking bright boys.
Part 1
Shane Doan- NMC for a guy who is “Mr. Phoenix” might not want out of the desert, he has shown a lot of dedication to the franchise and has been with it for his entire career (Winnipeg/PHX). Power forward who almost always turns it on in the second half of the season. I have been a Doan fan for over a decade, I would love to see him Rangers blue… if the price is right.
Vinny Prospal- A known commodity, which is a plus. We also know, however, that he is prone to injury. Still, if the price is right I would add him into the fold for depth or if we can get rid of an ugly contract in the process.
Ryan Smyth- Has a NMC. He went back to Edmonton because that is where he wants to play and end his career I am sure. I don’t see him moving, even with the Oilers out of the playoff picture.
Frans Nielsen- Amazing PK guy that has good speed and can contribute offensively. Sounds familiar? That is because we have a shit load of them already. The Islanders would never deal anyone who has good potential to us.
Milan Hejduk- Similar in some ways to Smyth in terms of a guy who I don’t really see as being moved. Also has a NMC and is 35 years old, the captain of a young team that is still very much in the playoff hunt (as of today they are 9th in the West by one point).
Andrei Kostitsyn- Only 26 years old, his asking price in a trade would be pretty high. I honestly don’t see a streaky player like Kostitsyn fitting into Torts’ system. I know he has wonderful hands and a lot of offensive upside but I just don’t see him working here. He would add offense though.
Paul Gaustad- At 29 years old he has never scored more than 40 points in a season. No thanks.
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Part 2
Brad Boyes- Is he the guy who scored 43 goals in ’07-08 or is he the guy who scored 17 in ’10-11? 29 years old… might work out in terms of adding some offense. I am sure playing on a line with Stepan or Richie would get his game back but it is all about asking price with guys like Boyes.
Tuomo Ruutu- Adds offense and a lot of nasty. The kind of player you fucking hate to play against but you love if they are wearing your team’s sweater. Shouldn’t be ruled out as a rental but he might demand a lot in return for a rental player.
Jason Garrison- On pace for 20 goals as a D-man. Florida is notorious for getting fleeced in trades… if we know Mikey Sauer isn’t going to be returning for awhile and want to try a younger version of Bryan McCabe let’s go ahead and give it a try. I personally don’t think Florida is going to be making any trades. they are playoff-bound at the moment in a very weak division. I do expect them to run out of steam sooner rather than later but there is nothing that says they are sellers right now. They are a team that would make moves to push themselves into the playoffs because as a franchise they REALLY need to make it to the postseason.
Pavel Kubina- Will he improve the powerplay? No. Pass.
Ray Whitney- Love the idea of picking up a war horse like Ray Whitney. The guy seems ageless… if we can get him for a mid-range draft pick or a mediocre prospect I would seriously consider it.
Lubomir Visnovsky- The Looooooooob. 68 points last year, on pace for maybe 40 this year (if he stays healthy). We all know he can contribute on the powerplay, but I don’t want go do go through another McCabe situation like we did last year (I know they are very different players). Maybe trade for him just so we can all chant “Looooooooooooob”. All about the asking price, lord knows that the Ducks are sellers right now. A draft pick or mediocre d-man prospect would probably do it. Who knows? Maybe we can trade them Stu Bickel back and convince them that he is 3 years younger than he was when they traded him to us.
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Loob would be a $5.6 mill cap hit with us next year. No thanks.
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players who'd fit:
Prospal, Whitney, Boyes, Ruutu.
Doan is a pipe dream. I have a feeling Sather’s up to something, the Rangers are far too quiet so far in the trade department
"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"
Boyes?
I’d say he is one player that wouldn’t fit whatsoever.
"You fucking loser!" - Sean Avery
"Just reload my weapon, you know?" - Artem Anisimov
The future is looking bright boys.
well, before his stock plummeted anyway
"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"
by feslenraster on Jan 18, 2012 10:49 AM EST up reply actions
Well the rumor I’ve seen from Lebrun I don’t know if anybody mentioned it here as I’m getting ready for Rangers and watching Giants read thru kinda quick but said shopping for a top 6 winger (obvious) and looking at Suter and Weber…do’t know how serious that might be in the works…
by Mr. Avery to you on Jan 15, 2012 6:56 PM EST reply actions
Suter or Weber costs us Staal, MDZ, or McDonagh, at least. One of them, a high pick and a decent prospect. If they’re moving either of them, it’s because of $, which means they want a younger player who is either A) already under a good contract for a good amount of years. Staal. Or B) an even younger player who’s still an RFA that they can put under contract for a lot less money than Suter/Weber.
I’d still love to have Weber. One of my favorite non-Rangers, and somebody like him would solidify our PP into a shoot-first/drive for rebounds format. Plus he kicks ass.
Also, if he comes here, it’s not as a rental, which means he’s getting a contract with a mid 6m cap-hit. That’s a lot to fit in without also upgrading our forwards.
Absolutely NO on Kositsyn and Boyes. Would not work well with this team at all IMO.
I’d love to see Doan as well as Prospal. These are the 2 I would love to get the most.
Ryan Smyth and Ray Whitney would be good also, but at the right price.
Gaustad could solidify our 3rd or 4th line, basically he takes one and Boyle takes the other.
I;d like Ruutu, Nielsen also but he isn’t an option. And not really sure about Hejduk, I guess if the price is low then I’d go for it.
"You fucking loser!" - Sean Avery
"Just reload my weapon, you know?" - Artem Anisimov
The future is looking bright boys.
I hate these kinds of posts
That’s not an attack on the author, and I thought it was well written with an educated opinion, I just can’t understand how people can get riled up about trades when we were just the top team in the NHL the first half of the season. Yes, there are players out there that are more talented than the guys we throw out on the ice every night. Yes, there is a chance our depth and our farm system could allow us to make a move, that could potentially make us better. But there is no telling what a trade would result in. But we can make one definitive statement; we were the best team in the NHL the first half of the season. The guys on our team play in Torts’ system and do so quite well. And there’s chemistry, familiarity, and success, something that can easily be ruined by a trade. Why make a move? We can win a cup with this roster, this season, no questions asked.
We can win a cup with this roster, this season, no questions asked.
I disagree and I think other people do also. We can get pretty far with what we have but we are going to need another winger. Whether any of the above mentioned guys is the answer who knows. We need someone else. We aren’t scoring enough goals and that’s what wins in the playoffs. Between 1955-2009 the team who scores the most goals won 62% of it’s games while the team with the fewer goals allowed has won 45% of it’s series.
The numbers above show why Boston would beat us in a series probably. They have the most goals for and least goals against. That’s a deadly combination. If I’m the Rangers I would make a move designed to beat boston. That starts by getting a Shane Doan. Someone who can play physical.
Also, you don’t really believe how a team does in a regular season means anything regarding playoffs right? The team that wins the President’s trophy isn’t guaranteed anything.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 16, 2012 11:50 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Between 1955-2009 the team who scores the most goals won 62% of it’s games
Change games to series.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 16, 2012 11:51 PM EST up reply actions
That being said, the Rangers aren’t much worse than Boston (if at all), and certainly Lundqvist is capable of getting hotter than Thomas for two weeks.
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I believe in next year.
by red army line on Jan 17, 2012 1:15 PM EST up reply actions
I'd still have to take Boston in a series over the rangers no questions asked
Until the rangers play Boston at least twice this season I don’t really know how they would stack up in the playoffs.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 17, 2012 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
They play similar types of games and I would dare say Boston is better at it as their players play that type of game better.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 17, 2012 1:57 PM EST up reply actions
But we can make one definitive statement; we were the best team in the NHL the first half of the season.
Funny, Green Bay was the ‘best team’ in the NFL according to record.
They home now.
But we can make one definitive statement; we were the best team in the NHL the first half of the season.
Wrong. They can make the statement they had the best record at the half way point. There’s a cavernous difference between the two.
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"Oh, that sensible and sober* Rangers fan guy who is cool, actually" - Dominik, Lighthouse Hockey
*Statement has not been verified nor regressed
by George E. Ays on Jan 17, 2012 9:33 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
We can win a cup with this roster, this season, no questions asked.
No, no we really can’t
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
by Kevin Power on Jan 17, 2012 11:20 AM EST up reply actions
we need another scorer or someone to help the PP. 3 for 41 somehow doesn’t cut it.
by Richter1994 on Jan 17, 2012 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
just make him the 3rd coach behind the bench and in charge of the PP.
by Richter1994 on Jan 17, 2012 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
I still think we’re outgunned by teams like Van and Boston. Pens too if they had any semblance of health.
Our PP has to be our biggest Achilles’ heel. There’s 0 threat of a shot from the point, and our forwards can’t screen the goalie for shit. So teams just back off and clog the box and wait for a bad pass so they can clear it.
Well if they play Vancouver in the playoffs that means they’ve at least reached the finals. I’d be thrilled that happens.
by MyFavBaseballSquadron on Jan 17, 2012 12:17 PM EST up reply actions
Way to take the positive approach
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 17, 2012 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
I doubt we lose a series because of the PP. This is a 5on5 type of team. If we don’t win it because we were not better on 5on5
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 17, 2012 1:59 PM EST up reply actions
against the Caps we were 1 for 21 on the power play
If we converted on those opportunities then its a completely different series
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
by Kevin Power on Jan 17, 2012 2:02 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
You could play that game all night. What if we didn’t hit the post? What if Henrik made that save? What if we shot instead of passing?
But I get your point, Obviously going under 5% for the PP aint gonna help. But I think this is a different team and would not expect it to be that dreadful.
I made the point in another thread…the difference between 15% and 20% PP in a 7 game series should amount to 1.4 goals. If this team loses a 7 game series I am sure it will not be because of that. If they play a dominate 5on5, get good PK and Henrik plays like he can then the PP should not be that much of a factor.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 17, 2012 2:16 PM EST up reply actions
You could play that game all night
Yes, you can play the “if you suck, you will probably lose game” all night. Obviously this is a broad statement, because the Rangers didn’t suck, but their powerplay sucked, and they lost. This is why you try to improve your team, so you don’t keep losing for the same reasons every year. We don’t want to play that game all night. We don’t want to see us net 11 goals in a 6 game series and come out on the short end. Which is why people are thinking of ideas to make this team better,
They were outplayed in every area in that series. That is why they lost. But as said a few times, this is not the same team.
Of course you look to improve. I have not been one of those people saying nothing is needed. We have holes that need to be plugged, most every team does so its not a slight just against the Rangers. My point is there are other areas/holes that should be addressed first that would give a better return. Its not like we don’t have the personnel to have a good PP. the pieces are there, just the execution isn’t. Even if you were to add the 1 PP piece, I am not so sure that cures the problem (ex. McCabe)
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 17, 2012 6:30 PM EST up reply actions
We’re a much better 5v5 team than we were last year.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 17, 2012 2:26 PM EST up reply actions
And now we’re a completely different team.
The PP isn’t the entire game.
And, see above.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
Says who?
We absolutely can. Sure, it’ll help to bring in another guy, especially if we don’t have to give up any of our core players already on the roster.
But to say we can’t win this season, looking at our record, is bullshit.
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
LET'S GO RANGERS!!!
by Moshe52792 on Jan 17, 2012 2:36 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I’m as big an advocate for this team as there is but we could add a little more scoring to put it over the top. a Doan/Prospal acquisition, not a huge trade.
If we could add both (though Maloney keeps saying Doan is not available) our lines would look like this…basically 1a, 1b, 1c, 3. Now that is what call depth
Prospal– Step – Gabby
Dubi – AA – Cally
Haggs – BR – Doan
Feds/Rupp – Boyle – Prust
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 17, 2012 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
Actually put Doan on the off wing with Step and Gaby then Gaby would have the gritty forward he needs and put Prospal on the 3rd line because he has slowed a lot in his skating which was a problem last year. and flip AA and BR, IMO.
No keep the Pack line together
They’re our best shutdown line against the other teams top line.
"You fucking loser!" - Sean Avery
"Just reload my weapon, you know?" - Artem Anisimov
The future is looking bright boys.
You could play with it of course. I went with the notion that Prospal has already shown he plays well with Gabby and the Pack line has shown good chemistry. If BR and Doan clicked then we should have not just 3 good line on paper but also on the ice.
Of course this is all conjecture since Doan by all accounts is not available. I would still like us to find someone to complement BR since it doesn’t appear we have that.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 17, 2012 6:35 PM EST up reply actions
At this point, what compliments BR? We’ve tried the speedy sniper, the grinding wingers, the decently skilled power-forward in Dubi…..
BR was brought here to make our players better, mainly Gaborik. Now that BR is….struggling, to a degree, we need to bring in players to ‘complement’ him? I think he needs to do more with what he has than worrying about fitting players with him.
He was supposed to help running the PP too from the point. That’s gone swell too. Time for him to stop worrying about Munn’s titties and start producing.
I think he's still adjusting
but he has every available asset to succeed.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 17, 2012 6:59 PM EST up reply actions
he and Olivia are no longer so maybe that’s what’s bothering him. playing in NY is not easy with the lifestyle it offers.
you talk about it as if we are talking about him being hounded by reporters and fans
nobody is forcing him to have sex with models. Poor guy, playing in NY hooking up with models, how can he possibly focus?
As currently constructed
can this team beat Boston in a 7 game series? Can they beat Chicago, Vancouver, Detroit, St. Louis? I don’t believe they can get past Boston as they are now
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
Yes. They may not be favorites, but they can.
Also, being a complete team is overrated. Boston’s defense corps wasn’t that good last year, Chicago’s goaltending the year before was all over the map, Pittsburgh didn’t have the greatest defense either and an average goalie, same with Detroit, Anaheim had a declining goalie, Carolina was just plain not-very-good (relatively).
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I believe in next year.
by red army line on Jan 17, 2012 3:20 PM EST up reply actions
Every team had their share of weaknesses but your almost making it sound like they got lucky to win.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 17, 2012 3:24 PM EST up reply actions
Well, yeah.
Take a very, very good hockey team that has a 70% chance of winning every series (that’s more lopsided than any series last year by Objective NHL’s model that incorporates Corsi, shot quality, goaltending, special teams, and schedule factors). That’s merely a 24% chance to win it all, once in four years.
I guess the way I see it, you’re probably not going to be able to build a complete roster with the salary cap in place (I think the only teams that have it are Boston this year, Vancouver the last two years, San Jose the last two years, and Detroit in 2006). Even if you can, the difference is what, one player? One player generally doesn’t influence a series that much, unless they get ridiculously hot.
I guess all I’m trying to say is it only takes Lundqvist to get hot, on the Rangers’ PP to get hot, or for Thomas to let in a couple of soft goals, and suddenly Bruins in 6 becomes Rangers in 6. The margin isn’t big at the top.
Red Line Station and @RedArmyLine, featuring coverage of the most frustrating team in the NHL
I believe in next year.
by red army line on Jan 17, 2012 3:34 PM EST up reply actions
I guess all I’m trying to say is it only takes Lundqvist to get hot, on the Rangers’ PP to get hot, or for Thomas to let in a couple of soft goals, and suddenly Bruins in 6 becomes Rangers in 6. The margin isn’t big at the top
Our best chance of winning against a top team in a playoff series is have an offense that can bury a few, and counting on Hank to frustrate them. We’ve got to make a move to get the PP going and give us another option to create their own goal up front.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 3:43 PM EST up reply actions
The PP is an overrated aspect. Yeah, it’d be nice to get it going, but you’re talking about a league wide difference of about 5%. We’re 6 goals away from being a top 10 PP% team, which could almost be done with dumb luck as fast as acquiring a player.
The PP just needs to stop looking for empty net goals and start putting pucks on net.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 17, 2012 4:13 PM EST up reply actions
It's not just the PP
But if you add some more people that can help the PP, you’ll be able to help pull us through the goal lulls that we get caught up in.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 7:20 PM EST up reply actions
George, they don’t even get chances on the PP. 2 shortened PPs last night and no shots. none. forget goals, I just want opportunities to turn the momentum of games in their favor. going on the PP is a downer for this team. it actually gives opponents 2 minutes to rest. that’s very sad. what’s so hard about putting Boyle in front of the goalie and have everyone else throw shots at the net? why is that so hard?
Think of it as a PK on steroids. 2 min of the other team not able to score on us ;)
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 18, 2012 7:19 AM EST up reply actions
Agree with you there.
Lundqvist is really the X factor for this team. I think I direct some of the blame for his performances in the playoffs to his team. He really dragged the team to the playoffs since the lockout and the fact he stretched the series against the Caps in 09’ to 7 games is unbelievable. The team scored 11 goals in 7 games. That’s awful.
The more I think about it though last year when Thomas wasn’t playing his best the Bruins just collapsed. He really had to play out of his mind just for them to win the cup and I can totally see Lundqvist doing that no problem.
Also, just having a threatening looking power play would go a long way.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 17, 2012 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
I agree with all of that but from what I’ve seen from boston and the other top teams in the NHL I’m not sure the Rangers can win it all this year…I’m not saying they won’t make the playoffs, I think they will and will go into the semi-finals but I just don’t think they can win the Cup this year
"Don't look now, but there's one too many people in this room and I think it's you." Groucho Marx
In Prust We Trust
"Kovalev would work with Tortorella like a kitty would work in a microwave.
A lot of smoke and desperate clawing at the door. It wouldn’t work. It would just be a big, hot mess." -Dig Deep
Follow me @8kpower
I just think we’ve had some guys play past their current levels. Now if we get Staal/Sauer back at 100% it’s a completely different animal.
Really it boils down to our defensive depth being able to hold off their forward depth. Figure goal-tending will be equal. It seems like these games would come down to match-ups (getting Gaborik away from Chara, and hoping our 2nd/3rd lines can score against the bottom half of their D).
So when can they win it, and what's keeping them from winning it
Every “next season” Hank is a year older, and he’s our biggest asset to get there. We’re a couple pieces away – A big d-man who can anchor the PP and some more consistent scoring – these parts are out there, and the guys available are in their primes, now’s the time to fill those holes and make our push.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 3:46 PM EST up reply actions
but, we can wait until 2015,
when all of the prospects we are protecting are at superstar elite level, then how can we lose? When people advocate for hanging onto the youth, they never seem to paint that negative what if picture. Kreider, Mcilrath, Miller, these guys always become elite players in these projections. I have been all for waiting at the deadline for the last decade. We had fringe playoff teams that were pretenders in terms of a cup. So we stood pat and let our system flourish and continue to grow, and this is why. So when we knew we were at a point to truly compete we had the assets to put us over the top, because we didn’t dump them for Marian Hossa/Dany Heatley 3 years ago at the deadline. Now is the time, this is our time. Don’t stand idly by and let your destiny pass you by because you are scared.
i think people are scared because if they bank everything on this year....
they might mess up the next 5 years if they didn’t win it all. Which is sort of how I feel.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 17, 2012 3:56 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
i'm not saying bank on everything this year.
I’m saying that for the first time in 10 years the risk is worth the reward in going for a big name player to put us over the top. This is possibly the first time since the 90s where we are 1 player away from a Stanley Cup run, a real, actual, legit cup run. Trading top tier minor league talent for top tier NHL talent didn’t make sense in the past. It does now.
Well, you have two camps going right now. Those that are sending every piece we have in the system to upgrade anything and everything we can, and others who are clinging to everything.
There’s a compromise there somewhere.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 17, 2012 4:18 PM EST up reply actions
I think this year came as a surprise to most folks. I think most in the ‘rational’ camp of people expected this to be a good year, yet there would still be some chemistry issues.
Obviously the injuries on defense and BRich not playing with Gaborik threw a few wrenches into that formula. But people also didn’t see a guy like Girardi playing all-star caliber defense, nor a 2nd year guy like McDonagh rocking ~25 minutes a game on the top shut-down pair, or MDZ doing a complete 180.
With the 1st-half success I think a lot of folks are thinking deep playoff run, maybe even reach the holy ground. It’s understandable.
In terms of trading, now is the time to add pieces to enhance our depth. That’s what cup teams do, they enhance their depth. Trading away current core pieces for other potential core pieces doesn’t make sense. You make trades that add around those core pieces.
We need scoring help, which I think everyone will admit. But that can’t come at the expense of our currently best LD or any one of our top 6 forwards, because that isn’t adding depth. Those types of trades, IMO especially for contending teams, are best done in the off-season where it’s not going to have a major impact on chemistry.
Sure, you can trade a pick/prospect for a depth guy like a Doan, or a Ruute, or a Whitney. You don’t trade 2 core players for another that will add maybe 10 extra goals over a full season.
by Caerid11 on Jan 17, 2012 6:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It feels so lonely in the middle.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 17, 2012 6:38 PM EST up reply actions
agreed.
I would be willing to move any minor league piece, and certain NHL guys to get that final puzzle piece. I don’t mean any combination of minor leaguers, but for a real impact player I think any one of our best prospects should be on the table, along with maybe Dubinsky, as much as it pains me, seems like a player that would have value in a trade but a player that we could possibly get by without. I see Callahan as a similar player, but being the captain and all, and being the (kind of) hometown favorite, he isn’t going anywhere. If a package of Dubinsky, top prospect, and some first rounders and some filler can get us a real impact player, I think it has to be considered. We should have faith in Sather and the front office to keep bringing in talent, as they have been for years now. What anybody’s definition of an impact player is may vary, so I will leave that for another thread, but as you said George, I think there is some middle ground between shooting our entire load right now and hording every asset we have.
You don't have to send every piece in the system
Put you have realize when there’s a better piece available, and when you have the resources available to add them.
by BuckarooClub on Jan 17, 2012 7:19 PM EST up reply actions
I agree with this,
while I might not necessarily agree with your take on who is more more valuable then who and by how much, I agree, it seems cold, but these players are assets. Nothing more, nothing less. If you can improve, you have to.
look, no one wants a trade unless it drastically improves the team
the Rangers have gone an amazing run thanks to depth, but we want and realize they need something more to beef this roster for the stretch.
"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"
by feslenraster on Jan 18, 2012 10:51 AM EST up reply actions
I also love how the objection to most of these trades goes something like
Hell no!! (Insert name here) would cost (insert prospects, players, and draft picks here). No fucking way it’s worth it! Seems silly to base your argument on a completely unsubstantiated piece of guessing on who or what so and so will want for who.
I know what your saying.
1) it’s a lot of fun to play armchair gm
2) It’s not that hard to figure out returns for certain players and their values.
3) It’s also not hard to figure out who teams will want and what we should or shouldn’t give up.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 17, 2012 3:54 PM EST up reply actions
well, I certainly didn't see any Gomez for McDonagh predictions,
or any Roszy for Wolski predictions either. There is no way of knowing how a player is perceived by another party. We don’t know the personal relationships, the opinions of the front office people involved, and a lot of other things that go into these trades, including straight up incompetence.
It goes both ways
There’s no definitive proof that emptying the prospect bin for a star player guarantees that team a Cup. How’d the Kovalchuk and Hossa (trade deadline move to the Pens) deals work out in recent years? Did Tomas Kaberle really do that much for the Bruins last playoffs?
I think a number of people here understand that while this team has done well this year and look poised to make some noise in the playoffs, they’re still not quite there yet. There’s a decent amount of cap room opening up after this year and maybe the Rangers can acquire players without ripping up some of the foundation they’ve taken quite some time to build.
by MyFavBaseballSquadron on Jan 17, 2012 4:17 PM EST up reply actions
Let's Go Back to 1994
At the trade deadline that year (March 20 or so) Neil Smith made a flurry of moves. In separate deals he jettisoned Amonte and Gartner and Todd Marchant for MacTavish and Anderson and Matteau and Noonan. Could the Rangers have gone on to win the Cup with Amonte and Gartner? Maybe. (I was sad to see them go, esp. Gartner.) But the four guys they got back were integral throughout the playoffs. Somehow “Amonte! Amonte! Amonte!” doesn’t sound quite the same.
Anderson offered just as much O as Gartner, waaaaay more playoff experience, and what — five Cups? The other three acquisitions made the team stronger in two-way forwards and, in Manslaughter’s MacT’s case, in defensive zone FO’s and three Cups.
we are in a completely different position now than 1994
Right now we are a borderline cup contender. That team was looking for every piece possible to help their run.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 17, 2012 7:22 PM EST up reply actions
The Rangers in 1994
won the presidents trophy, with 112 points. Right now, the 2011 Rangers are on pace to win the presidents trophy, with 114 points. Totally different position…….
The Rangers aren't the best team in hockey......
They’re overachieving. If they are still playing like this at the deadline i’ll ease up a bit and maybe go for it then. Still too soon to say.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 17, 2012 7:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree with you that the Rangers are probably not the best team in the NHL although the standings say that and they might be overachiving.
But you know what I find interesting..name me one player on the team that is personally overachieving?
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 17, 2012 9:37 PM EST up reply actions
Good point
they’re really playing as a unit and that’s what’s helping them. There are certainly players under achieving but guys like Hagelin and Mitchell are picking up the slack.
It’s really a team effort night in and night out and they’re really playing tortorella style hockey to a tee.
Is hockey hard? "I don't know, you tell me. We need to have the strength and power of a football player, the stamina of a marathon runner, and the concentration of a brain surgeon. But we need to put all this together while moving at high speeds on a cold and slippery surface while 5 other guys use clubs to try and kill us, oh yeah did I mention that this whole time we're standing on blades 1/8 of an inch thick? Is ice hockey hard? I don't know, you tell me. Next question."
-Brendan Shanahan
by RichieToGabbySCORE on Jan 17, 2012 10:38 PM EST up reply actions
But you know what I find interesting..name me one player on the team that is personally overachieving?
Biron.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 17, 2012 11:54 PM EST up reply actions
True, I will give you Biron. But I still find it interesting that on a team that is overachieving the only player personally overachieving is the back up goaltender.
Im not trying to be a smartass and dismiss POD and such just I really find it strange that we have a bunch of important players not playing their their potential (BR, Dubi and AA for example) and we are where we are.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 18, 2012 7:26 AM EST up reply actions
You said “name me one.” I can name others. Del Zotto for one.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 18, 2012 8:32 AM EST up reply actions
Stepan has a really high PDO, too.
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by red army line on Jan 18, 2012 8:36 AM EST up reply actions
He has an insanely hot girlfriend too. That's the bigger personal overachievement
by MyFavBaseballSquadron on Jan 18, 2012 9:10 AM EST up reply actions
Dubinsky (who is 2nd among our forwards in PDO) would be in 9th on the Bruins.
I have no idea how that correlates, but I find individual-level PDO to be much more wonky.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 18, 2012 9:46 AM EST up reply actions
I just feel that outside of Crosby no one or combination of players on an NHL team right now can reliably shoot 11+%.
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by red army line on Jan 18, 2012 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
Looks like a few guys that have done it 2 out of 3 years (D. Sedin, Kovalchuk), but yeah, looks to be reserved for the elite.
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by George E. Ays on Jan 18, 2012 12:20 PM EST up reply actions
Now who is being the smartass ;)
Seriously, do we even know what the upside for players that have played 2 season in the league? I would think based on management expectations that MDZ is playing where they think he could be. Now I don’t see MDZ ever leading the league in points and if he did I would be inclined to say he is over achieving.
My point is I don’t think anyone is having Boyle of last year season, one where you look at it and think they will never be able to get better or even reproduce their performance.
Aucune clause de Mouvement
by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 18, 2012 12:20 PM EST up reply actions
Well, I’m misinterpreting your meaning of ‘over-achieving’ then. Sure, if you’re talking about long term potential or the so-called ‘career year,’ then sure, MDZ doesn’t get included, since one would like to think he has a higher ceiling.
I was encompassing a lot of definitions there, pre-season expectations, boxscore numbers (and/or ‘luck), potential, and of course ’gut feel.’
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by George E. Ays on Jan 18, 2012 1:05 PM EST up reply actions
Sorry I wasn’t clearer then.
Basically yeah, who is playing way above their head which in turn is making the team play above it’s head. I understand luck plays into it but to me its still a good sign that we have a lot of players could have room to improve and our success isnt based on a few players having abnormal career years.
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by Blueshirt in Paris on Jan 18, 2012 3:02 PM EST up reply actions
Rupp took away Dubi's scoring touch!
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by feslenraster on Jan 18, 2012 10:53 AM EST up reply actions
He’s shooting 30.8% !
Blueshirt Banter - Where Rangers' Fans Matter
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"Oh, that sensible and sober* Rangers fan guy who is cool, actually" - Dominik, Lighthouse Hockey
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by George E. Ays on Jan 18, 2012 11:22 AM EST up reply actions
thats the point,
not the best team in hockey, but clearly a contender with a bit of help. Hasn’t been the case in years
What is the rush to force it?
If you asked people around here about their expectations for the Rangers from July 1st to October 1st, the common answer was that 2011-2012 would be a year of improvement that would put us on the cusp of contention and that 2012-2013 and 2013-2014 would be our “serious contender” seasons. We got BRich and chemistry would develop over this season. The next 2 seasons would see Gabby and Hank still in their prime and under contract, as well as the rest of the core. July 2012 would see us with a bot of cap room and with a couple of prospects ready to possibly make the roster in August.
So now, we are doing better this season than planned, and some would say we are over-achieving. Most would agree that Boston would be a challenge in the post-season and probably a loss. I am not sure what the rush is, to trade away something from our core and try to force our way to “serious contender” this year. Obviously, there are some trades that make sense, but ditching anything from our core seems somewhat short-sighted to me.
Of course, I am fickle and jump on the “Ooooh that would be a good trade” bandwagon myself sometimes… but if any of those trades turn out having a higher cost, costing a player we had in our plans for the future, I am hoping Slats doesn’t pull the trigger.
how do you know gabby doesn't get hurt?
he has a history of it. How do you know Hank won’t pull a Richter and blow his knee out on the post? See, some people who want the big trade are labeled greedy, I think the stand pat crowd is greedy. They just assume everyone will get better. They assume nobody gets hurt, they assume we get the players we want in FA and that all of the kids improve, make the big team, and then fit in seamlessly. Who cares if a bunch of people thought the Rangers wouldn’t be competitive this year? They very clearly are. The truth is, I didn’t see this coming, but I also didn’t see any real cup contention in the near future unless something unforeseen happened.
The whole core thing, I agree on. As I said earlier, I would be willing to move Duby in a package for a top line winger, a really good one, but thats about it. But in my opinion, prospects shouldn’t be untouchable right now. I am perfectly fine with trading away a player for the future, because that’s the only way you’re getting any real talent back. I think some fans just get too caught up in the idea every prospect will end up how we want them too. If we had to trade Kreider, or Miller, or any of our top prospects, at least we never had them, so the big team is improving immediately. I see your point in trading core parts since the improvement would then be minimal, but 50 percent of the reason you draft good players is so they can eventually play for you in the NFL. The other 50 percent is to develop assets that you can use to “fund” your playoff run in the form of veteran reinforcements. Theres no point in holding onto every guy hoping they make it, because there are only limited openings anyway.
go for it all
call me crazy but we have to get iginla why you say well how do we know if we are going to be just as good next season like we are now. so package a zucc haglen for iginla i want the cup this year i dont want to wait any longer neither does the king
lohaus #54
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